the B20F WILL be tuned!!

yknot · Post by **yknot** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 11:08 am

but why do not use a b18ft swap?.... is the easiest and cheap way to obtain more power than your 2.0 n/a.....
....its like you want to scratch the left ear with the right hand...

gltease · Post by **gltease** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 11:11 am

Esta, just go buy a 480 Turbo, richmod, and be done with it

Oh wait I just forgot what the thread was about !

chriskay · Post by **chriskay** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 11:45 am

Agree with gltease. Whatever you do to your present engine will not give you much bang for buck. If you fit a different engine, apart from the cost, you might find your insurance doubles. Just buy a nice Turbo (no, mine's NOT for sale).

esta · Post by **esta** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:09 pm

I gotta be honest I am not planning on swapping the engine.

The head mods I have enquired about can add about 40bhp, still waiting for bottom end results.

A turbo is tempting, but it doesnt appear that the Richmod is that easy to come by, with ECUs and waiting for the next batch to go plus it would mean having to sell Lula, so I would just want a straight swap to be honest!!

Ettore Bugatti · Post by **Ettore Bugatti** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 3:59 pm

If you want 20hp or more you also need to think the engine managment system.

chriskay · Post by **chriskay** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 4:05 pm

esta wrote:
A turbo is tempting, but it doesnt appear that the Richmod is that easy to come by, with ECUs and waiting for the next batch to go

So, get the ECU & have it richmodded. Then go & buy a Turbo. I've got a blue ECU (I think that's '92 onwards) which I'd sell. Then I think the mod is Ã‚Â£80. This has got to be better value than spending nearly Ã‚Â£700 for only 40 BHP. A richmodded Turbo should be kicking out 170 BHP+. (I'll let you know next month).

Cheers, Chris.

Edit: Ettore has a good point there.

esta · Post by **esta** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 4:10 pm

chriskay wrote: So, get the ECU & have it richmodded. Then go & buy a Turbo. I've got a blue ECU (I think that's '92 onwards) which I'd sell. Then I think the mod is Ã‚Â£80. This has got to be better value than spending nearly Ã‚Â£700 for only 40 BHP. A richmodded Turbo should be kicking out 170 BHP+. (I'll let you know next month).

OK let me know! If it DOES produce more power, I will have first dibs on that ECU (if you please

) and get it Richmodded!! That would be awesome!!

And if it IS as good as that then I will be in for a 480 swap!

Or maybe a turbo engine in Lula....?

just cos I know all her good points...if a R5 owner can strip a 480T for an engine so can 480 owner lol!!

Yossarian · Post by **Yossarian** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 5:07 pm

Shame it isn't a 16v engine.

Of course, the engine you secretly want is the 5.3 V12. Go on! Admit it!

esta · Post by **esta** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 5:09 pm

Yossarian wrote: Of course, the engine you secretly want is the 5.3 V12. Go on! Admit it!

Oooo no no no! I want the later 6l V12

Twin cat 330bhp quad exit-and being pre-93 I can de-cat...!!!

Maybe I should just hold my horsies and get the Jag ASAP!!

pa.chab · Post by **pa.chab** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 5:54 pm

Anyway, I know someone very interested by your 480 2.0l job

Someone wich own a tiny Lufy, far far away in France...

Someone jealous of my turbo Moka

Best regards,

Paul.

esta · Post by **esta** » Tue Dec 09, 2008 5:56 pm

pa.chab wrote:However, I know someone very interested by your 480 2.0l job

Someone wich own a tiny Lufy, far far away in France...

Someone jealous of my turbo Moka

Best regards,

Paul.

Hello Paul!

I do indeed know a gorgeous British beasty far far away in france by the name of Lufy!!

Hello and welcome to the club!

And yes I do hear he is very jealous of someones turbo! Nice to say hello!

Esta

Ettore Bugatti · Post by **Ettore Bugatti** » Wed Dec 10, 2008 2:51 pm

You should always keep in mind what you want to achieve and what your resources are.

Sure, for 170hp the cheapest way is buying a turbo and selling Lulu. A transplant is probably a bit more expensive. However you end with an engine which isn't rebuild. When it is rebuild it is more costly, beware of this. Don't compare a rebuild tuned N/A engine to a junkyard turbo engine + richmod.
The same story is about swapping a 16V engine in it. (Although you already mentioned that is beyond the scope)

Supercharging is also an option (I researched a lot of that) where figures around 150hp is IMHO cheaply to achieve, but circa 170hp quite more expensive/ difficult.

An N/A build is also possible, not a lot of people are known to this. Which carefulling optimizing parts (no heavy modification) you could end with 130 hp (big exhaust; gasflowing and porting of: throttle body, std manifold etc.) Higher then 130 hp is more costly/trouble to achieve and is probably hurting the drivability too.
Here I posted how I would tune any N/A Volvo 480.
http://volvo480.dragons.org.uk/forum/vi ... sc&start=0

This a general view how I look to the possibilities.

esta · Post by **esta** » Wed Dec 10, 2008 7:55 pm

Ettore Bugatti wrote: http://volvo480.dragons.org.uk/forum/vi ... sc&start=0

thanks for this link

i will be saving some money up and seeing where i should take it from there. for novelty factors i want to mod the 2l, everyone is doing turbos, fancy trying something different. on the other hand, if you get more power for less with a turbo, then would that make me daft??

greasy mits · Post by **greasy mits** » Wed Dec 10, 2008 9:37 pm

al depends wat sort of power you want esta i would say turbos are way more fun and you can get a lot more power easy out of one but it all depends on what you want

eEm · Post by **eEm** » Thu Dec 11, 2008 10:18 am

I'd go for a roots type supercharger personally (or a G-lader to stay in keeping with 480 heritage), turbo wiring loom and ecu's and a transverse mounted intercooler. I just love the sound of supercharged engine....

one day

aibast · Post by **aibast** » Thu Dec 11, 2008 11:12 am

hmm, does the 2.0L have its combution chamber in the head or in the piston? You can maby raise the compression. ITB intake, tubular exhaust. Bigger injectors so you wouldn't lean out. Bigger valves. High octane fuel and on you go. PS Don't expect the engine to last long like that.

Ettore Bugatti · Post by **Ettore Bugatti** » Thu Dec 11, 2008 4:59 pm

Yes, the B20F has the combustion camber in both piston and head. I have the slight idea that installing B18U pistons in a B20F block will give a CR of 10,7:1. I have to invest that further though.

ITB (indivudual throttle bodies) sounds awesome and increase the flow into the head, but the air pressure will be totally different to the stock situation that you can't use the ECU. BMW K1100 itb's on a custom manifold are the way to go, btw. Cheaper option is to convert to carbs (Keihin, Mikuni)
With ITB I always would go for a wilder cam, since revs and increased flow create massive power.

The option of eEm isn't stupid either.

I would prefer the following tuning order for a B20F:

Stage 1:
-K&N replacement filter + Cold air bigger intake.
-480 Turbo CSC sports exhaust system (or equivilant) optional I would remove the cat.

Stage 2:
-Bosch 4 bar fuel pressure regulator (for enrichment in open loop and better mixing of the fuel)
-advanced Hall sensor for advanced ignition

Stage 3:
-gasflowing+porting of manifolds (intake and exhaust) and throttle body.
-portmatching of the manifolds
Optionally you could look for a nice 4-2-1 exhaust manifold.

Stage 4:
-gasflowing+porting of the cylinder head
-uprated camshaft
optionally a remapped ECU would be ideal, but expensive.

Stage 5:
-Forced induction or an engine swap (turbo or 16V)

I first try stage 1, 2 and 3. These aren't really expensive if you are little bit creative.

Auk · Post by **Auk** » Sat Dec 27, 2008 11:39 pm

I do like the thing with ITB's.

On the VTEC engine's it sounds grazy!

But does anyone know what the difference is between the F3R FRS Renault Sport engine and the normal F3R / B20F ?

My car is almost finished and now I'm looking for any power increasing of my stock 2litre.

It's interesting to read about it!

Dan the 480 Man · Post by **Dan the 480 Man** » Sun Dec 28, 2008 9:53 am

Well, I'll give it to you Esta, you're always up for trying something out!

I actually found the 440 to be quite nippy with the B20f lump, and it was lugging the great old thing about on big wheels and a rock concert in the boot! Whats the official BHP of a B20f? 109hp? or is it 112? Can't remember. A stock Turbo is 121hp, so even if you dumped a Turbo lump in, thats already about 10hp extra....not alot for the work involved, but when you think you can get that upto 170hp (ish), then thats a big performnce gain. If you bought a donor Turbo, you'd have all the spares you want for your car, from interior to body panels, or you could sell them off to fund the project. If you bought a donor Turbo, you could strip the engine (to whatever extent you're happy with) and rebuild it whilst your GT is still in use.

For the work and cost involved, I admire your enthusiasm for trying to squeeze more ponies out of the 2.0. And it would be great to see someone achieving good results from the 2.0i, but I personally think you'd have to have a very deep pocket to do so.

Bangs for bucks, it's got to be a Rich-mod'd Turbo. I know he doesn't do them commercially anymore, but I'm sure of you contacted him and was prepared to travel down to him one day he'd do it for you. The Turbo was good fun anyway, but when that ECU was plugged in it turned the car into a caged beast!

Just my two-penneth worth

Toreto · Post by **Toreto** » Sun Dec 28, 2008 1:12 pm

esta wrote: i will be saving some money up and seeing where i should take it from there. for novelty factors i want to mod the 2l, everyone is doing turbos, fancy trying something different. on the other hand, if you get more power for less with a turbo, then would that make me daft??

HI!
Have you considered turbocharging your current engine? A 2.0l turbo should be fun