From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

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Sunny Jim
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Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2021 8:01 pm

From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by Sunny Jim » Fri Jun 25, 2021 8:32 pm

Hi, I'm Jim a newbie from North Wales encouraged to join up by jifflemon after he kindly answered my plethora of questions on Facebook. Having had a poke about I recognise a few usernames from the beige and look forward to putting more faces and cars to names at the FoTU next month.

I have a thing about eighties designed wedge-shaped cars and was seeking a companion for my Citroen BX 16 RS Estate but was struggling to find a 480 that was within my budget that wasn't beyond my capabilities to get on the road. A recent bout of insomnia has found me scouring listings in the wee small hours and one night an ad popped up on Facebook market place for a 480 an hour away from me close to my theoretical budget. The ad sounded promising, the MOT history not too scary AND it was peacock green!
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The Wayback Machine helped me discover the car had been for sale for 17 weeks at gradually reducing asking prices and some handy buyers guides including the one from this very site meant I knew what to look out for. Prices are all over the place and as we all know what a car is advertised for isn't always what is sells for. The vendor said he'd bought it from a local garage before lockdown but then it had developed some faults and he'd not had the money to sort them out. When I contacted him on WhatsApp his profile picture was of a car transporter so it seemed likely he was a trader of some sort. So buying from a driveway trader off Facebook market place, what could possibly go wrong? I arranged to go and view the car resolving to walk away if I couldn't bargain him down to what I was prepared to pay.

He let me spend a good hour systematically going over the car while I compiled a list of issues in addition to the ones he'd mentioned. I hate negotiating so I was straight with him and said look I could pretend to be Mike Brewer and offer you and insultingly low figure and we can go back and forth but here's where I'm at. I showed him other ads (and how long they'd been up for) and my list of issues with a rough guesstimate of what it would cost to sort them and named what I was willing to pay (two thirds of his asking price). "Old art yer 'and," he said. "Hang on," I replied, "You've got a car transporter and as the car isn't currently driveable on the road (the indicators don't work) I want it delivered." He hummed and harred but eventually we shook on it.

I left a £50 deposit and two days later he delivered it to my work - I found it very hard to concentrate for the rest of the day - it was like being a kid on Christmas Eve!
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Last edited by Sunny Jim on Fri Jun 25, 2021 8:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sunny Jim
480 Newbie
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2021 8:01 pm

Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by Sunny Jim » Fri Jun 25, 2021 8:45 pm

My initial look over the car produced the following to do list:

4 new shocks - rears 'slightly corroded', fronts 'lightly misted'

2 new front tyres

New Battery

Sort exhaust blow and investigate rusty cat

Rear of sills where it meets rear arch doesn't look too bad but I want to sort it before it gets any worse
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Replace damaged daytime running light
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Investigate oil leak on front of engine - optimistically hoping it might just be coming from the filter or rocker cover gasket rather than anything more serious?
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Sunny Jim
480 Newbie
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2021 8:01 pm

Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by Sunny Jim » Fri Jun 25, 2021 8:53 pm

Decide what to do about damage rear lights and rear centre panel - attempt repair, buy secondhand or splash out on the French repos
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Sunny Jim
480 Newbie
Posts: 19
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Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by Sunny Jim » Fri Jun 25, 2021 8:58 pm

And replace the battery and track down a CEM3 in the hope that they'll cure the inoperative indicators, hazards, electric windows and central locking.

Other than that it's gorgeous and very photogenic.
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Hope the BX doesn't get jealous and start playing up.
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jifflemon
480 Is my middle name
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Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by jifflemon » Fri Jun 25, 2021 9:10 pm

Welcome aboard!

So..... I can 100% vote for the french rear lights.

However

I'd put them quite far down the list for the moment unless you have the Euro's sat around. I'd tell everyone to buy a set, simply because I know the cost of having things remade, and if somone has gone to the effort of doing it, I'll damn well support it! Plus, how may people have said "Oooo, I should have bought some rear lights whilst they were still available at volvo"? Well, they're available NOW. Get them whilst you can, because at some point, they'll not bother making anymore!

But... Moving on....

CEM does sound to be a very likely suspect. Have you tried a self test?

Other things I recommend when recommissioning a slumbering 480.
1) A damn good clean - Interior out, vacuum everything.
2) The popup service - AKA the Brinkie Winkie Dance.
3) Rear shocks will ABSOLUTELY be dead, fronts may have life.
4) pressure wash the arches, front and rear. Then get a metric tonne of cavity wax injected.

You have, however, already done the most important thing: Joining this forum!

jifflemon
480 Is my middle name
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Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by jifflemon » Fri Jun 25, 2021 9:13 pm

oh and DRL's....

IN the first pic it has it, then it doesn't.

Do you have it, or has it been lost? Either way, LED bulbs are the future. If you hate the colour and insist on incandescent, then ALWAYS run with the pop up's up. This means the bulbs are only at 4w and have slightly less chance of melting your lamps.

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dcwalker
480 Is my middle name
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Location: York

Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by dcwalker » Fri Jun 25, 2021 9:18 pm

Looks lovely! Well done in joining the happy band of 480 owners that you'll find on here :lol: :D

I have PM'd you...

David
Current: 1994 480 GT, 1996 460 CD & 1997 440 LE with lots of optional extras & 2007 V50 SE Sport
Previous: Celebration 331 (re-homed with Richard S), Celebration 467 (returned to Martin Mc); Celebration 346 (re-homed with Alan480); Celebration 269 (scrapped abandoned project), Celebration 73 (sold on after 6 years), 1992 ES, 1988 ES - and numerous other non-480 Volvos!

Sunny Jim
480 Newbie
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2021 8:01 pm

Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by Sunny Jim » Fri Jun 25, 2021 9:51 pm

Thanks jifflemon and David! Unfortunately I don't have a wodge of Euros lying around but do agree with what you're saying about the French lights. Do you know what the lead time on them at the moment is? My step-sister has a place in France so depending on timings I could possibly get them delivered there and get her to bring them back when she's next able to visit avoiding the VAT and duty hassles and in the meantime do what I can to polish up my existing lights and rear panel and possibly cover them in clear tape or a very light tint to try and preserve them in the interim.

I've yet to try the self-diagnose of the CEM - that's a job for tomorrow. The car is currently stored at my workplace and we've had biblical quantities of rainfall here in North Wales today so I couldn't get any tinkering time on the car after work. I believe my car has the diagnostic point in the engine bay (in front on the N/S strut in this picture) should I go for that or the connecting two wires in the passenger footwell method? or both?
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The blocked drains and generally mucky state of the bulkhead might explain the CEM problems do you think?
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Pop-ups are now working fine. The video of them working erratically that I'd posted on the beige was after the vendor attempted to turn them on while the bonnet was up when I was viewing the car, they've been fine since.

A damn good clean inside and out is certainly on the cards - hopefully this weekend depending on weather. What cavity wax would you recommend? Has anyone any experience of using lanolin based rust preventers? I quite like the idea of using a natural product and wonder if I could source any locally - there's no shortage of sheep in my part of the world! https://www.lanoguard.co.uk/collections ... ack-bundle

Rear shocks, exhaust and two new front tyres are all priorities too. The car is currently SORNed - I'm hoping to get my hands on a CEM soon cos I'd love to get the car taxed and on the road for July. I had hoped I'd hear from the guy who offered me one today but I've not heard anything yet.

First pic is from the Facebook Marketplace ad - as I said it had been on the market for at least 17 weeks and the DLR must have got damaged and gone missing in that time (it didn't come with the car). The same guy who's hopefully supplying the CEM did say he might have some light units for sale but I want to see the condition before parting with any money.

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dcwalker
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Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by dcwalker » Sat Jun 26, 2021 7:47 am

Looks very promising Jim!

All diagnostics on the later models is done via the little box on the left hand column under the bonnet; the two wire method was for earlier CEMs.

You should find you can do a fair amount towards keeping the lights you have going with some care and effort. There's plenty on here you may well have already found... :D

Blocked scuttle drains are a common problem and your surmise is very likely to be correct. If the water can't escape it builds up, then gets into the footwells and down the sides of them, which is where the DEM (passenger side) and engine ECU (driver's side) are sitting squarely in line to receive an unwelcome bath!

As per our PM's I'd suggest holding fire with your other potential CEM source for the moment.

David
Current: 1994 480 GT, 1996 460 CD & 1997 440 LE with lots of optional extras & 2007 V50 SE Sport
Previous: Celebration 331 (re-homed with Richard S), Celebration 467 (returned to Martin Mc); Celebration 346 (re-homed with Alan480); Celebration 269 (scrapped abandoned project), Celebration 73 (sold on after 6 years), 1992 ES, 1988 ES - and numerous other non-480 Volvos!

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dragonflyjewels
480 Is my middle name
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Joined: Sat Dec 18, 2010 10:38 am
Location: Norfolk

Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by dragonflyjewels » Sat Jun 26, 2021 8:00 am

I'm very pleased to see that this one has found a safe pair of hands - well done on buying it, it's a great colour and looks well worth the effort to sort the problems.

The reference to Norfolk is quite intriguing, but you mentioned the car wasn't far from you. Did it originate in Norfolk ? The main dealer in Norwich was apparently inundated with orders for them back in the day. On a recent visit there we chatted to a staff member who said the transporters were constantly in and out with 4 series cars and a surprising number of them were 480s.

We will be at FOTU with 2 of ours, hope to see you there. Always good to meet in person - we've yet to meet Jay Kay Em as well. Fingers crossed we all make it.
Sylvia

Snazzy - 1993 Paris Blue ES red dipstick 2.0i bought 2001
Lethal Lily - 1991 White Turbo
Paris the Unicorn - 1991 Paris Edition
hubby has
Sven - 1994 Racing Green GT
Evil Eva - 1992 Paris Blue Turbo

no previous 480s - can't bear to sell any

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brinkie
480 Connoisseur
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Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by brinkie » Sat Jun 26, 2021 8:06 am

Regarding the CEM, a member of the Dutch 480 community has recently passed away and his ex-wife (who also drove 480) brought a large box of instrument clusters, ECUs and CEMs which used to belong to him, which I will pass on to those in need of a CEM. Ben already got one (which subsequently fixed his car) and if your CEM is the problem, I will be most happy send one for just €18.50 which is the postage.
However, the indicators have the peculiarity to stop working if something is wrong in the hazards switch. So check that one first.
Robert.

Present cars: 1994 Volvo 480 GT 2.0i, 1999 Volvo S70 2.5 Europa, 2010 Volvo V70 2.0F Momentum

Sunny Jim
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Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by Sunny Jim » Sat Jun 26, 2021 9:00 am

Thanks all. I will try the self-diagnose later today and have accepted a member's kind offer to send me a CEM to see if it fixes the problem. Does anyone have any ideas/leads for the DRL? I was considering swapping to LEDs as jifflemon suggested and perhaps trying to source a lens cover of similar dimensions off something else from the scrappies and if necessary trimming it down and glueing it on to keep the fitting water tight - a bit of a bodge until I perhaps go for some French repos. Something like this https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/282361731667 ... Sw2gxYpDSQ

@dragonflyjewels - yes I hadn't got round to explaining the thread title yet had I? Your summation is quite correct. The car was originally supplied by Hylton Gott of KIngs Lynn and is still sporting it's original dealer plates and sticker on the rear screen.
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It would be interesting to discover when and why it made the journey across the UK. I bought my Citroen in Norfolk and drove it back to North Wales too so I have form with 'imported' cars! I have the name and address of who I presume was the first Welsh owner from an old V5 I found in the extensive history file that came with the car so I plan to drop him a line and see if he's willing to shed any light on the car's story.

A friend from another forum who has a thread on unusual cars he's spotted photographed it in Ruthin back in 2019 so it's been in this neck of the woods at least that long.
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I note that the rear wiper arm was already drooping a that point (it's loose on the spindle). Would bushing it with some PTFE tape work or does anyone have one they'd be willing to part with please?

I'm also sporting one odd wheel trim on the OSR so will be trying to source one to match the other three:
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Should I put a wanted ad in the parts section?
Last edited by Sunny Jim on Sat Jun 26, 2021 10:40 am, edited 1 time in total.

jifflemon
480 Is my middle name
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Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by jifflemon » Sat Jun 26, 2021 10:30 am

Cavity wax: the mighty bilt hamber s50 gets my vote.

Rear lights; I believe they make them to order, or perhaps in small batches. 4 weeks is the longest I’ve heard of waiting. But some headlamp protection tape would certainly be a good temporary measure. I’d also recommend putting some on the front fogs as they’re hideously expensive to replace!

DRL: I’ve not managed to find anyone yet to make some, some Joep in the Netherlands can help (€75 a pair).

Wheeltrims you may struggle with, but alloys are plentiful.

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MisterH
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Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by MisterH » Sat Jun 26, 2021 11:19 am

Hi there Jim, this was where I lurked before entering the beige!

You have a really nice one there, glad to see someone is saving the base models, and you don't hang about either!

What you said about going with a straight negotiating tactic will definitely come in useful for me, I have my eye on a hideously overpriced Audi 90 quattro at the moment, pending me being able to shift the cursed Rover :wall:
Current Jobs to do (23/1/22):
Fix Central Locking
Fix drivers side speaker
Annoying Scratching Squeak
Water leaks
Complete Front O/S rebuild

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dcwalker
480 Is my middle name
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Location: York

Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by dcwalker » Sat Jun 26, 2021 1:48 pm

Just re-reading this thread and I notice you mention electric windows not working.

Othe common reasons for that are broken regulators (yes, both, the plastic fittings grow brittle with age and break away) and loose connections at the back of the switches. There are a lot of wires wedged into a space there barely big enough for them and if some has played around with the handbrake etc the come adrift quite easily...

Less likely if it's both windows, I grant you, but worth bearing in mind!

David
Current: 1994 480 GT, 1996 460 CD & 1997 440 LE with lots of optional extras & 2007 V50 SE Sport
Previous: Celebration 331 (re-homed with Richard S), Celebration 467 (returned to Martin Mc); Celebration 346 (re-homed with Alan480); Celebration 269 (scrapped abandoned project), Celebration 73 (sold on after 6 years), 1992 ES, 1988 ES - and numerous other non-480 Volvos!

Sunny Jim
480 Newbie
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2021 8:01 pm

Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by Sunny Jim » Sat Jun 26, 2021 6:41 pm

Hi Mr H, good to see you here and good luck with the Audi - I guess it all depends on how much the vendor wants to sell. The guy I bought the car off had had it for sale for at least 17 weeks that I'm aware of so I was in a fairly strong position.

Thanks for the tip about the windows David, I know the driver's side motor works after a fashion following my diagnostic session this evening but I'm getting ahead of myself.

I had to go into work this afternoon to do some prep for next week so didn't start my tinkering session until gone five. I'd printed off Ben Harris' guide to the diagnostic unit for the CEM III so started with trying to find any faults stored on the memory. I tried a couple of times and both yielded the same result: no faults stored so I moved on to testing input signals. This is where I started to get a bit confused - trying to count the succession of flashes reminded me of trying to read lights at sea in the middle of a night watch (any other sailors on here?). I was tired and hungry and it was only afterwards that I realised that I must have knocked the column stalk indicator switch which explains why I kept getting code 2-5-4 no matter what I tried! Oops!
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I moved on to testing the output signals which was more successful. I definitely observed the central locking opening and closing, driver's window opening and then closing nearly all the way up and then stopping an inch short*, horn sounding, front and rear wipers, headlight washer, indicators and finally auxiliary driving lights. It was quite freaky seeing the car do all that while I stood and watched - the horn made me jump even though I knew it was coming! I then tried to trigger individual output signals but I don't know if I was doing something wrong entering the codes as I couldn't get anything to work.

To be honest I'm not really sure what to make of it all as I didn't really know what I was doing! Thankfully somebody has offered to send me a CEM III to try to see if that will cure the problems I'm experiencing.

*I tried running tests again but couldn't get the window to move again. I'm satisfied that at least the driver's side motor works. In the end I resorted to gripping the glass between two flat palms and pushing the window shut. I experienced a similar problem on my BX and was able to cure it by removing the door card and cleaning and re-lubricating everything. I've read somewhere that the door card clips on the 480 are unobtainable so made the wise decision not to attempt it while I was tired and hungry and much more liable to make a mistake and break something. It can wait for another day.

I'm going to have a break from the Volvo tomorrow while I catch up on some jobs on the BX and check another car over that's gong for an MOT on Monday. I look forward to getting back at it next week doing some cleaning and restoring of plastics while I await the CEM.

Sunny Jim
480 Newbie
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2021 8:01 pm

Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by Sunny Jim » Sat Jul 03, 2021 3:50 pm

I finally got round to fitting the CEM that a fellow member here had kindly sent me yesterday. The instructions I'd read talked about removing the two screws and "dropping the unit down" which I was struggling to do.
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I ended up removing the bonnet release mechanism to give myself more space to get the units in and out.
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I'm pleased and relieved to report that it's done the trick and I now have working indicators, windows and central locking - hurray! I quickly got online to get some tax and sort some temporary insurance and was ready to hit the road for the first time.
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I'm lucky enough to live in a beautiful part of the world with some wonderful driving roads. I did a 40 mile loop around the mountains along some of my favourite twisties and was grinning from ear to ear. I can see why you guys are so passionate about these cars.
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I did notice however that when I pulled over to take pictures the cooling fan would kick in when I switched the engine off although the temp gauge didn't go above one third. I drove the eight miles into work this morning, the last quarter of mile of which is very steep and the temp gauge went up to three quarters and as I pulled into my parking space the engine temperature light came on. I immediately switched off and let the engine cool while I got on with my work.

When I'd finished I checked the level in the expansion tank and it was low so although I can see no sign off it I'm guessing I must have a coolant leak somewhere. There is no evidence of 'mayo' on the oil filler cap and the coolant appears clean so I'm hopeful that it's not a head gasket problem but at the moment it's a bit of a head scratcher - I might get a local garage to do a sniff test to rule out HG and maybe a pressure test to see if they can spot where the coolant is escaping from. I've just thought while I type this that although the coolant doesn't look bad I've no idea when it was last changed so maybe a flush and refresh wouldn't hurt.

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dcwalker
480 Is my middle name
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Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2012 12:30 pm
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Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by dcwalker » Sat Jul 03, 2021 5:01 pm

Pleased to hear you're making progress Jim and that the CEM seems to have done the trick!

Coolant - I always use the genuine Volvo stuff. It's no dearer than any other good brand and ar least that way you know you've got the right stuff.

Given what you've said about the temp gauge and fan I would change the thermostat while you're at it. You need a 92 degree one - there are two different ones!

David
Current: 1994 480 GT, 1996 460 CD & 1997 440 LE with lots of optional extras & 2007 V50 SE Sport
Previous: Celebration 331 (re-homed with Richard S), Celebration 467 (returned to Martin Mc); Celebration 346 (re-homed with Alan480); Celebration 269 (scrapped abandoned project), Celebration 73 (sold on after 6 years), 1992 ES, 1988 ES - and numerous other non-480 Volvos!

Sunny Jim
480 Newbie
Posts: 19
Joined: Thu Jun 24, 2021 8:01 pm

Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by Sunny Jim » Sat Jul 03, 2021 7:12 pm

That sounds like a good idea. Thanks for the advice.

jifflemon
480 Is my middle name
Posts: 2464
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Re: From Norfolk to North Wales - SJ's 480S

Post by jifflemon » Sat Jul 03, 2021 8:11 pm

Your gauge not working correctly sounds typically dashboard. Just because there’s no infocentre, doesn’t mean they don’t go wrong!

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