480 and the ULEZ

Here you can talk about the joy owning a Volvo 480 brings. Non-technical discussions take place here, like what is the difference between an ES and a S version.

Moderators: jifflemon, coyote1980, Rachel

Silver480S
480 Newbie
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Jun 07, 2014 6:23 pm

480 and the ULEZ

Post by Silver480S » Mon Aug 09, 2021 1:11 pm

Hi everyone
I haven't posted for a while but always stop by to pick up some tips.
As you may know, the Ultra Low Emissions Zone is expanding in London in October. I've received a letter from Transport for London to tell me that my car may not be compliant with the new EUR4 emissions threshold and they are assuming that it isn't compliant. My car is 28 years old so I don't know how I can check if it is compliant or not. It currently passes the EUR3. I'd hate to see the car go but I don't want to pay £12.50 per day just to do local journeys.
Does anyone have any ideas?
Thank you.
Jean
My car is a 480S 1.7 1993

jifflemon
480 Is my middle name
Posts: 2464
Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2016 11:03 am

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by jifflemon » Mon Aug 09, 2021 1:15 pm

The only vehicles exempt are:

Vehicles that meet Euro 6 - introduced in September 2015 for cars and September 2016 for vans - are exempt, as are some models that met the standard earlier
Almost every petrol car registered from 2005 and some registered between 2001 and 2005
Petrol cars registered after 2006
Motorcycles sold after July 2007
All electric vehicles - since they are zero-emission, making them ULEZ exempt.
Cars built more than 40 years ago
Vehicles with a historic tax class
Military vehicles
Some farm vehicles
Circus vehicles

Silver480S
480 Newbie
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Jun 07, 2014 6:23 pm

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by Silver480S » Mon Aug 09, 2021 1:33 pm

Hi, thanks for your reply.
I had read the basic info about the categories but it would appear that some cars may not fit certain categories but could meet the EUR4 standard. Was just wondering if the 480 might fall into this anomalies criteria. Maybe it's wishful thinking but I'd thought I'd ask anyway.
Thanks again.
My car is a 480S 1.7 1993

Alan 480
480 Is my middle name
Posts: 1489
Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2011 9:03 am
Location: Aberdeen

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by Alan 480 » Mon Aug 09, 2021 6:02 pm

jifflemon wrote:
Mon Aug 09, 2021 1:15 pm
The only vehicles exempt are:

Military vehicles
Some farm vehicles
Circus vehicles
some suggestions.

paint it in camo paint and claim 'military'
cover in poo with rugged tyres & it's a tractor
add a clown sticker?

wishful thinking?
Alan

480 ES 2litre 'Celebration' ? , C30 1.8ES, SS1

nicklee
480 Newbie
Posts: 34
Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 1:23 am
Location: London

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by nicklee » Tue Aug 10, 2021 9:08 am

Glad someone's raised this. I'd intended to for a while but hadn't got round to it...

Whilst this only affects Londoners and people living in other cities with clean air zones atm, this is clearly the direction of travel with petrol/diesel cars and we're all a long way off the historic exemption. The ULEZ rules are infuriating because i'd be able to drive a 1979 non-catalyser Saab 900 (for example) for free, but my clean-by-comparison catalysed 480 will be £12.50 a pop.

I've had my 480 since 2008 (and for 80,000 miles) and i'm reluctant to give it up, but it'll just sit around dong nothing as i've got another (newer!) ULEZ compliant car.

A friend of mine who runs a garage in Tottenham (Terry's Ltd - surely one of the best garages in the capital if anyone needs one, check out the reviews ;) also has an old Volvo (a limited edition V40 i think) and he wrote to Volvo to get original emissions data for the car. Turns out it is ULEZ compliant even though the TFL checker says it isn't. So I am now in correspondence with the Homologations team in Sweden trying to get original emissions data for my 1992 1.7ES. It's a long shot, but I there's a slim chance that it might meet Euro4. Having said this, so far the Homologations team hasn't been able to find any data - so maybe it's lost and we'll never know! But if i do get the emissions data i'll post it up here, ULEZ complaint or not.

I've also been toying with the idea of an engine swap or electric conversion, but that's obviously a huge outlay. At 193,000 miles it's probably due an update, but the idea of having an electric car with 1980s brakes, suspension and rust troubles me... and i really wanted to get to 200,000 on the Renault lump.

Depending on how things pan out there may be a very high mileage Paris Blue 480 with Vesa wheels and leather interior up for grabs later this year...

Image
1992 Paris Blue 480 ES

User avatar
MisterH
480 Is my middle name
Posts: 1161
Joined: Sat Nov 24, 2018 6:15 pm
Location: Stockbridge

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by MisterH » Tue Aug 10, 2021 10:32 am

nicklee wrote:
Tue Aug 10, 2021 9:08 am
Glad someone's raised this. I'd intended to for a while but hadn't got round to it...

Whilst this only affects Londoners and people living in other cities with clean air zones atm, this is clearly the direction of travel with petrol/diesel cars and we're all a long way off the historic exemption. The ULEZ rules are infuriating because i'd be able to drive a 1979 non-catalyser Saab 900 (for example) for free, but my clean-by-comparison catalysed 480 will be £12.50 a pop.

I've had my 480 since 2008 (and for 80,000 miles) and i'm reluctant to give it up, but it'll just sit around dong nothing as i've got another (newer!) ULEZ compliant car.

A friend of mine who runs a garage in Tottenham (Terry's Ltd - surely one of the best garages in the capital if anyone needs one, check out the reviews ;) also has an old Volvo (a limited edition V40 i think) and he wrote to Volvo to get original emissions data for the car. Turns out it is ULEZ compliant even though the TFL checker says it isn't. So I am now in correspondence with the Homologations team in Sweden trying to get original emissions data for my 1992 1.7ES. It's a long shot, but I there's a slim chance that it might meet Euro4. Having said this, so far the Homologations team hasn't been able to find any data - so maybe it's lost and we'll never know! But if i do get the emissions data i'll post it up here, ULEZ complaint or not.

I've also been toying with the idea of an engine swap or electric conversion, but that's obviously a huge outlay. At 193,000 miles it's probably due an update, but the idea of having an electric car with 1980s brakes, suspension and rust troubles me... and i really wanted to get to 200,000 on the Renault lump.

Depending on how things pan out there may be a very high mileage Paris Blue 480 with Vesa wheels and leather interior up for grabs later this year...

Image
Wait is that an actual Paris Blue Special Edition?
Current Jobs to do (23/1/22):
Fix Central Locking
Fix drivers side speaker
Annoying Scratching Squeak
Water leaks
Complete Front O/S rebuild

jifflemon
480 Is my middle name
Posts: 2464
Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2016 11:03 am

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by jifflemon » Tue Aug 10, 2021 10:36 am

MisterH wrote:
Tue Aug 10, 2021 10:32 am
Wait is that an actual Paris Blue Special Edition?
I'm thinking the EXACT same thing! :shock:

jifflemon
480 Is my middle name
Posts: 2464
Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2016 11:03 am

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by jifflemon » Tue Aug 10, 2021 10:40 am

nicklee wrote:
Tue Aug 10, 2021 9:08 am
Glad someone's raised this. I'd intended to for a while but hadn't got round to it...

Whilst this only affects Londoners and people living in other cities with clean air zones atm, this is clearly the direction of travel with petrol/diesel cars and we're all a long way off the historic exemption. The ULEZ rules are infuriating because i'd be able to drive a 1979 non-catalyser Saab 900 (for example) for free, but my clean-by-comparison catalysed 480 will be £12.50 a pop.

I've had my 480 since 2008 (and for 80,000 miles) and i'm reluctant to give it up, but it'll just sit around dong nothing as i've got another (newer!) ULEZ compliant car.

A friend of mine who runs a garage in Tottenham (Terry's Ltd - surely one of the best garages in the capital if anyone needs one, check out the reviews ;) also has an old Volvo (a limited edition V40 i think) and he wrote to Volvo to get original emissions data for the car. Turns out it is ULEZ compliant even though the TFL checker says it isn't. So I am now in correspondence with the Homologations team in Sweden trying to get original emissions data for my 1992 1.7ES. It's a long shot, but I there's a slim chance that it might meet Euro4. Having said this, so far the Homologations team hasn't been able to find any data - so maybe it's lost and we'll never know! But if i do get the emissions data i'll post it up here, ULEZ complaint or not.

I've also been toying with the idea of an engine swap or electric conversion, but that's obviously a huge outlay. At 193,000 miles it's probably due an update, but the idea of having an electric car with 1980s brakes, suspension and rust troubles me... and i really wanted to get to 200,000 on the Renault lump.

Depending on how things pan out there may be a very high mileage Paris Blue 480 with Vesa wheels and leather interior up for grabs later this year...

Image
Honestly, don't get me started on ULEZ's.... :angry: or even this madness that somehow buying an electric car will save the world...

Converting the car's isn't worth it - Enjoy them for what they are, as they are. I'd absolutely LOVE to see way more pictures of your car if it is indeed a mythical Paris edition - Heck even if it's not, I'd still love to know more about the car, because with nearly 200k on it, it sounds like it's been enjoyed!

User avatar
dragonflyjewels
480 Is my middle name
Posts: 1584
Joined: Sat Dec 18, 2010 10:38 am
Location: Norfolk

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by dragonflyjewels » Tue Aug 10, 2021 12:01 pm

Sorry to burst the bubble of excitement, but those are black pin stripes and it's registered as ES so sadly not a Paris Edition. Interestingly, my Paris Blue ES has done 230k, instead of go-faster stripes maybe it's a go-further colour :lol: Before the makeover, I'd have mistaken this for mine which has also had Vesa wheels and a front splitter for a long time. Looks lovely, it'll be such a shame if it has to go. I did read somewhere that catted 480s had lower-than ULEZ emissions when new, can't remember now where I saw it but it does need to come from Volvo. Given that Ford tried to eradicate all records of the 480 I wouldn't hold out much hope.
Sylvia

Snazzy - 1993 Paris Blue ES red dipstick 2.0i bought 2001
Lethal Lily - 1991 White Turbo
Paris the Unicorn - 1991 Paris Edition
hubby has
Sven - 1994 Racing Green GT
Evil Eva - 1992 Paris Blue Turbo

no previous 480s - can't bear to sell any

nicklee
480 Newbie
Posts: 34
Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 1:23 am
Location: London

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by nicklee » Tue Aug 10, 2021 2:09 pm

Thanks Sylvia, and as you point out, sadly it's not a special edition - it's got the standard black and grey leather interior and the black (rather than green) pinstripe.

I'll try and take/upload some pics - i'd intended to once it got to 200,000 miles as a celebration of its longevity!

But here's a bit of info about the car, to flesh out the pic above (which, incidentally, i didn't take and found on a Danish 480 webpage - fame!):

I bought it for £400 in 2008 at 110,000 miles and became its fourth owner. It has - if you're willing to accept records and receipts for work i've done myself - a pretty much full service history. I still have the original stamped service record (up to 80,000 miles i think) and piles of receipts from the two owners after that. It's never been off the road, but it appears to have been partially resprayed on its nearside, so must have been in a scrape at some point... (i don't have a receipt for that, so i'm speculating).

The front of the car is in great shape - i treated it to a bumper claimed from a garaged write-off and it has crystal clear clusters (i've insulated the connectors on the DRL bulbs so they only ever operate at the lower output). Subframe is pretty much rust free and the pop ups have always popped up. All the major stuff has been done and redone - 3x cam belts in my ownership, 2x clutch, water pump, alternator, ABS accumulator, radiator, thermostat (x2) and hoses, PAS pump, starter, front and rear main oil seals, cam shaft seals, dizzy, gearbox radial seals, nearside driveshaft replaced, both wishbones, linkages, tie-rod ends etc. It currently doesn't lose fluid apart from a bit of oil which i think is coming from around the sump seal. The best thing i ever did was get the replacement driveshaft (SKF), which solved my gear oil woes once and for all!

The back of the car is not so good. But this informs my general perception of the 480 - the front was well-designed, the rear not so much. Must have had four back-boxes in my ownership and both rear arches are messy - not rusting at present, but not pretty either... Both rear sills have been welded, as has the offside rear seatbelt mount (this will need to be done again for next MOT). Rear bumper looks very ropey, 'catalyser' badge has decided to start to peel off. Rear clusters are ok and only let in a bit of water in monsoon conditions (we have those in London now), wiring to tailgate has been redone by me (again not pretty) but all the electrics work as they should.

And on that note - touch wood - i've never had any electrical problems. The info centre has always worked perfectly, as i say the pop-ups have always worked, the sunroof works (new pins ;)) as do windows, mirrors, aerial, wipers, fans etc etc etc (i've no doubt jinxed it all by writing this!). Idle issues have been fixed by adjusting the idle screw and keeping plugs fresh, control valve and EGR system clean.

On the inside it's got its original instrument cluster showing 193,000 miles, hardly any peel (just a bit on the rev counter), auxiliary gauges, original radio cassette, digital clock, intact seatbelt arms, soft-touch ashtray. Driver's seat is a bit tatty (that's the one I mostly sit in to drive), but the others are excellent. I replaced the ignition barrel and switch to solve an intermittent starting issue.

The car - aside from overheating just after i bought it (bad hose) - has never let me down. I've taken it all over the country and it's never broken down and never left me stranded. The biggest problem i had was the intermittent starting and that was just worn out ignition barrel parts - by 180,000 miles it had clearly been started many many times :D

It's still on its original fuel pump, which occasionally worries me, but not enough to do anything about it. The Teves MK2 ABS once saved the car (and me) from a write-off on the M25. It was wet and i was convinced we weren't going to stop, but with a god-awful report from the nearside front wheel, the car came to a halt centimetres from the bumper in front. Whatever that ancient ABS did, it didn't sound good, and it consumed most of the break pad, but it worked!

All in all, it's a fantastic and weirdly reliable car. A money/time pit, yes, but a very rewarding one. And i've only ever replaced old worn out stuff, to be fair - totally standard for a car of this age. This is why i'm so reluctant to get rid of it - it would quite happily carry on going for many more miles as far as i'm concerned, especially as so many of the running gear essentials have been renewed.

oh we've had some good times ;) I'm crossing my fingers for the emissions data! Supposedly Volvo were always ahead of the curve on this...
1992 Paris Blue 480 ES

Alan 480
480 Is my middle name
Posts: 1489
Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2011 9:03 am
Location: Aberdeen

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by Alan 480 » Tue Aug 10, 2021 5:43 pm

the daft thing with ULEZ is that you can run a four or five litre 'super SUV' that does 20mpg (maybe 38 at best on open road) but not a 480 that does 30 -35mpg AROUND town ?? :shock:
Alan

480 ES 2litre 'Celebration' ? , C30 1.8ES, SS1

Silver480S
480 Newbie
Posts: 15
Joined: Sat Jun 07, 2014 6:23 pm

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by Silver480S » Thu Aug 12, 2021 11:52 am

I'm going to see if my independent Volvo specialist has any useful information. I've also been reading some articles about a 'retrofit' for the exhaust system. I will also ask my garage about this too.
I would hate to get rid of my car because of the ULEZ so I will report back when I get any info.
Jean
My car is a 480S 1.7 1993

User avatar
Macaroon
Advanced 480 rookie
Posts: 532
Joined: Tue Mar 21, 2006 2:43 am
Location: Sunny Brixton, Sarf London

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by Macaroon » Wed Aug 25, 2021 10:26 am

nicklee wrote:
Tue Aug 10, 2021 9:08 am
Glad someone's raised this. I'd intended to for a while but hadn't got round to it...

A friend of mine who runs a garage in Tottenham (Terry's Ltd - surely one of the best garages in the capital if anyone needs one, check out the reviews ;) also has an old Volvo (a limited edition V40 i think) and he wrote to Volvo to get original emissions data for the car. Turns out it is ULEZ compliant even though the TFL checker says it isn't.

So I am now in correspondence with the Homologations team in Sweden trying to get original emissions data for my 1992 1.7ES. It's a long shot, but I there's a slim chance that it might meet Euro4. Having said this, so far the Homologations team hasn't been able to find any data - so maybe it's lost and we'll never know! But if i do get the emissions data i'll post it up here, ULEZ complaint or not.
I've also been intending to chase this, so I appreciate somebody getting onto it. I mostly use Facebook groups these days so don't look in the forum much, but I'm glad I did.

The ULEZ rules only specify that NOx emissions be EURO 4 compliant (i.e. below 0.08 g/km) so full EURO certification isn't an issue, however, TfL do not state what they accept as evidence of emission compliance, other than a V5.

I have messaged TfL requesting this information but have yet to receive a reply - and I'm not holding my breath.

This TfL page https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/low-em ... -standards lists recommended Emissions reduction technologies to qualify for the LEZ:
Selective catalytic reduction, which reduces NOx emissions
Replacement Euro VI engines
Converting a vehicle to electric power
Retrofit technologies need to be approved by the Clean Vehicle Retrofit Accreditation Scheme (https://energysavingtrust.org.uk/servic ... on-scheme/). However, there is no retrofit solution for petrol vehicles, and CVRAS states: Purchasing a second hand Euro 4 petrol car could be the most economical solution to comply with a ULEZ

With a 28 year old car, 12 years is a long time to wait for exemption.
Tonee: '93 Two Tone. High mileage but nice 'n' tidy.
Sheba: '91 ES Paris Special. Love that leather, baby. Scrapped and used as a spares car.

Image

nicklee
480 Newbie
Posts: 34
Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 1:23 am
Location: London

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by nicklee » Thu Aug 26, 2021 6:24 pm

My friend got original emissions data from Volvo (for his supposedly noncompliant V40) and submitted this to TFL. TFL then sent him a letter saying that his car meets the requirements of the ULEZ and wouldn't be subject to the charge. He laminated the letter and showed it to me :D

I'm still waiting to hear back from the homologations team at Volvo (in Sweden), but apparently they've returned from their summer holidays now and should send me some info soon.

As ever, fingers crossed and I'll report back with whatever I get in relation to my B18FP. As Macaroon points out, the car only has to meet the Euro 4 NOx standards, but who knows what they tested it for back in the early nineties...
1992 Paris Blue 480 ES

User avatar
dragonflyjewels
480 Is my middle name
Posts: 1584
Joined: Sat Dec 18, 2010 10:38 am
Location: Norfolk

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by dragonflyjewels » Thu Aug 26, 2021 8:53 pm

nicklee, have sent you a pm
Sylvia

Snazzy - 1993 Paris Blue ES red dipstick 2.0i bought 2001
Lethal Lily - 1991 White Turbo
Paris the Unicorn - 1991 Paris Edition
hubby has
Sven - 1994 Racing Green GT
Evil Eva - 1992 Paris Blue Turbo

no previous 480s - can't bear to sell any

User avatar
volcar16
480 Newbie
Posts: 37
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2016 6:07 pm

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by volcar16 » Sun Aug 29, 2021 10:12 pm

I had a letter from Transport For London last week telling me my 480 may not be ULEZ compliant and I was baffled for several minutes as my 480 lives in Yorkshire and has never been to London. I eventually twigged it may be because the prefix private plate has HX for central London in it.
1995 Volvo 480 Celebration 244/480 (owned 20 years)
2002 Volvo C70 T5 Coupe (owned 16 years, featured in "Classic & Sportscar" magazine, May 2021)
2009 Mercedes A160 (the sacrificial car used for work protecting the Volvos :D )

User avatar
MisterH
480 Is my middle name
Posts: 1161
Joined: Sat Nov 24, 2018 6:15 pm
Location: Stockbridge

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by MisterH » Mon Aug 30, 2021 9:59 am

I live near Winchester and I got a letter through about it, my car was a Reading register originally, so that could be why, unless they are sending a letter out to every ineligible car in the country...
Current Jobs to do (23/1/22):
Fix Central Locking
Fix drivers side speaker
Annoying Scratching Squeak
Water leaks
Complete Front O/S rebuild

User avatar
Macaroon
Advanced 480 rookie
Posts: 532
Joined: Tue Mar 21, 2006 2:43 am
Location: Sunny Brixton, Sarf London

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by Macaroon » Mon Aug 30, 2021 11:00 am

Could be that they are sending letters to everybody, given that the ULEZ will extend all the way to the South Curcular.
Tonee: '93 Two Tone. High mileage but nice 'n' tidy.
Sheba: '91 ES Paris Special. Love that leather, baby. Scrapped and used as a spares car.

Image

Alan 480
480 Is my middle name
Posts: 1489
Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2011 9:03 am
Location: Aberdeen

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by Alan 480 » Mon Aug 30, 2021 7:08 pm

Macaroon wrote:
Mon Aug 30, 2021 11:00 am
Could be that they are sending letters to everybody, given that the ULEZ will extend all the way to the South Curcular.
surely not, us mere mortals 'north of Hadrian's wall' have a long way to go and be assulted/robbed byt TfL ? :wink:

they will do it for far less in Aberdeen, Edinburgh and have re-introduced random one way systems in Inverness (back to what they were in 1970s) :shock:
Alan

480 ES 2litre 'Celebration' ? , C30 1.8ES, SS1

nicklee
480 Newbie
Posts: 34
Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 1:23 am
Location: London

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by nicklee » Mon Sep 13, 2021 3:35 pm

Got a reply from Volvo - and not a very helpful one:

I am very sorry, but we failed to find emission information about this old car, also after looking in our historical archive.
This type were certified by NedCar in the Netherlands, and we don’t have access to their old files.
Also it is too old to have a WVTA, which would have given us clues about approval numbers and emission values.

I've now emailed NedCar in the hope that they have something... no reply yet. Don't suppose anyone in the Netherlands has a contact at NedCar...?

Sylvia helpfully pointed out that there are some ongoing discussions about ULEZ on the Volvo 480 UK facebook page. They're pretty technical and refer to the New European Driving Cycle which was used to produce emissions and economy figures. This has been around since the 70s apparently but was updated in 1997. So who knows what this means for the humble catalysed 480!?! Seems as though no one has definitive answers atm.

C'mon NedCar...
1992 Paris Blue 480 ES

Post Reply