480 and the ULEZ

Here you can talk about the joy owning a Volvo 480 brings. Non-technical discussions take place here, like what is the difference between an ES and a S version.

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Macaroon
Advanced 480 rookie
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Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by Macaroon » Mon Sep 13, 2021 5:17 pm

As one of the participants in the - all too technical – discussions on the Facebook page, I regret that there’s probably not much chance of finding out from those avenues.

Thank you for pursuing Volvo in Sweden.

Hopefully NedCar will turn up something useful.
Last edited by Macaroon on Mon Sep 13, 2021 6:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Tonee: '93 Two Tone. High mileage but nice 'n' tidy.
Sheba: '91 ES Paris Special. Love that leather, baby. Scrapped and used as a spares car.

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jamescarruthers
480 Is my middle name
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Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by jamescarruthers » Mon Sep 13, 2021 6:02 pm

Hopefully someone there still proud of their wonderful little car and will make the effort to help out. They really don’t have to but maybe if by good luck the right person is found they could help out.
1987 Volvo 480 ES, 507274, 217 - Red (Ness)
2006 Citroen C6 Exclusive 3.0 petrol/LPG
2008 Mini Cooper convertible (Mau)

Previous 480's:
J123 CFU -- ES
J449 MNL -- ES auto
D864 CPV -- ES
L691 JFC -- Turbo
F70 MNR -- ES
H858 FGV -- Turbo auto
E981 KHM -- ES (509849)

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dragonflyjewels
480 Is my middle name
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Location: Norfolk

Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by dragonflyjewels » Mon Sep 13, 2021 6:10 pm

hmmm. Think I'll talk to Eric, he is in touch with a lot of useful 480 people in the Netherlands and also has a huge collection of documentation.
Sylvia

Snazzy - 1993 Paris Blue ES red dipstick 2.0i bought 2001
Lethal Lily - 1991 White Turbo
Paris the Unicorn - 1991 Paris Edition
hubby has
Sven - 1994 Racing Green GT
Evil Eva - 1992 Paris Blue Turbo

no previous 480s - can't bear to sell any

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dcwalker
480 Is my middle name
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Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by dcwalker » Tue Sep 14, 2021 8:59 am

I have no idea how to interpret it, but isn't the information on the white sticker on the underside of the bonnet - or at least some of it - to do with emissions?

David
Current: 1994 480 GT, 1996 460 CD & 1997 440 LE with lots of optional extras & 2007 V50 SE Sport
Previous: Celebration 331 (re-homed with Richard S), Celebration 467 (returned to Martin Mc); Celebration 346 (re-homed with Alan480); Celebration 269 (scrapped abandoned project), Celebration 73 (sold on after 6 years), 1992 ES, 1988 ES - and numerous other non-480 Volvos!

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brinkie
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Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by brinkie » Tue Sep 14, 2021 10:30 am

nicklee wrote:
Mon Sep 13, 2021 3:35 pm
Got a reply from Volvo - and not a very helpful one:

I am very sorry, but we failed to find emission information about this old car, also after looking in our historical archive.
This type were certified by NedCar in the Netherlands, and we don’t have access to their old files.
Also it is too old to have a WVTA, which would have given us clues about approval numbers and emission values.

I've now emailed NedCar in the hope that they have something... no reply yet. Don't suppose anyone in the Netherlands has a contact at NedCar...?

Sylvia helpfully pointed out that there are some ongoing discussions about ULEZ on the Volvo 480 UK facebook page. They're pretty technical and refer to the New European Driving Cycle which was used to produce emissions and economy figures. This has been around since the 70s apparently but was updated in 1997. So who knows what this means for the humble catalysed 480!?! Seems as though no one has definitive answers atm.

C'mon NedCar...
You need to contact Volvo Netherlands in Beesd. They have information on file but it is all in Dutch.

I have emissions information about the 1995 model year, models GT 2.0, GT 2.0 Automatic and GT Turbo. GT for the Dutch market is an option package for the last model year with almost every option thrown in: 15" Taurus alloys, ABS/TRACS, aircon, front spoiler, front fogs, powered antenna, passenger seat height adjustment and leather upholstery - moonroof was the only factory option which could be ordered on top of that.

For a download of the Dutch information, click here (my personal Dropbox upload)
Robert.

Present cars: 1994 Volvo 480 GT 2.0i, 1999 Volvo S70 2.5 Europa, 2010 Volvo V70 2.0F Momentum

nicklee
480 Newbie
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Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by nicklee » Tue Sep 14, 2021 10:46 pm

Thanks Robert, this is really helpful.
So, assuming that i've read these correctly, the 1.7 turbo engine emits 0.29 g/km of NOx. the ULEZ limit for petrol engines is 0.08g/km.
What are the chances that the manual n/a 1.7 goes that low...?

Interesting to see that the 2.0 n/a unit produces more NOx than the 1.7 turbo.

So now we just need to get our hands on the versions of these docs for the B18FP engine... I'll try an email to Volvo Netherlands.
1992 Paris Blue 480 ES

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brinkie
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Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by brinkie » Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:34 am

Chances are very slim. Engines in the 480 are Euro 2 compliant, for the ULEZ your car needs to be Euro 4 compliant.

A turbocharged engine is more efficient than the normally aspirated one, so that is why their emission figures are better.
Robert.

Present cars: 1994 Volvo 480 GT 2.0i, 1999 Volvo S70 2.5 Europa, 2010 Volvo V70 2.0F Momentum

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Macaroon
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Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by Macaroon » Wed Sep 15, 2021 11:11 am

brinkie wrote:
Tue Sep 14, 2021 10:30 am

I have emissions information about the 1995 model year, models GT 2.0, GT 2.0 Automatic and GT Turbo.
Thank you Robert - it's really useful (but disappointing). I guess it's case closed, as the B18 isn't going to be 5 times lower than the B20

My Dutch isn't great (I speak German, so technical stuff isn't impossible), but it looks like these tests were carried out by the Dutch Ministry of Transport in 1993 to EU standards.

Next to pollution/emissions (Luchverontreinigung) is a list of numbers: E4 70/220 93/59 0011 01
I understand these refer to the EU directives which set out the test criteria and test cycles.

93/59 refers to the Euro 1 test applicable in 1993

More significantly, 70/20/EEC was introduced in 1970 and remained valid through Euro 4 (though updated several times) - so, if the 480 had passed Euro 4 emissions in these tests*, TfL would have been obliged to them. Sadly that appears not to be the case.

[Edit, the test cycle is slightly different: Urban with 40s idle + EUDC for Euro 1 & 2 vs Urban with 10s idle + EUDC for Euro 3 & 4]

It's interesting to note the fuel consumption in these tests. The 2.0i Manual GT report shows consumption of 8.0 l/100 km (35.3 mpg). According to official fuel consumption data for 1993 models, the B20F with manual box should be as follow:

Urban 10.7 l/100km (26.4 mpg)
56 mpg 5.9 l/100 km (47.9 mpg)
75 mph 7.8 l/100 km (36.2 mpg)

This suggests that the test cycle gives better mpg than a standard urban cycle, sitting roughly midway between Urban and constant 56mpg, and is close to the Motorway cycle of constant 75 mpg. Not that this helps us much, but it's interesting to know.

It also explains why the EUDC NOx text is so different from the Fast Idle test used at MOT (for CO and HC, not NOx)
Tonee: '93 Two Tone. High mileage but nice 'n' tidy.
Sheba: '91 ES Paris Special. Love that leather, baby. Scrapped and used as a spares car.

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brinkie
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Re: 480 and the ULEZ

Post by brinkie » Wed Sep 15, 2021 1:15 pm

The tests were carried out by "Rijksdienst voor het Wegverkeer" (Government Agency for Road Traffic) which is the Dutch counterpart of the DVLA. They handle both vehicle registrations and approvals.

The tests are dated May 24, 1994 and are valid for the 1995 model year of the 480. In that model year, the Dutch market had their version of the 480 GT and these documents cover all GT versions (2 litre, 2 litre with auto box and 1.7 turbo), the cars are subsequently registered as 480 GT 2.0I, 480 GT 2.0I AUTOMATIC and 480 GT TURBO. But for the final model year you could also order a poverty spec 480 ES 2.0I with blanking plates for the front fog lights, steel 14" rims with manhole covers and there is a documented case with blanking plates for the speakers! There is no documentation for the ES, though we suspect Volvo Netherlands must have it somewhere in their archives. Thankfully, Volvo Netherlands has been at the same spot since the 1970s and they have a very large basement where until recently cars were stored with just 10 miles on the clock, including a 340 from 1991 which has never been registered (now in a private collection of a Volvo main dealer, proudly on display)

Pollution is measured against 70/220 but as you already said this was constantly updated. In 1994, Euro 1 was still the norm for new cars (Euro 2 came into effect in 1996), but... pollution figures shown *are* Euro 2 compliant. Cars in 1993 and 1994 model year were registered as 480 S E2 or 480 TURBO E2 where E2 denotes Euro 2. 1991 and 1992 model year were registered as 480 ES U9 and 480 TURBO U9 where U9 was an old designation of cars with three-way catalyst, so we can safely assume the 1.7 engines with catalyst (B18EP/FP) are Euro 1 compliant.

Euro 2 requires CO (Carbon monoxide) emissions to be below 2.2 gr/km and NOx (Nitrogen oxide) to be below 0.5, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_ ... enger_cars
So, this is what they submitted as test data:
480 GT 2.0 1995: CO 0.822 gr/km; NOx 0.408 gr/km
480 GT 2.0 Automatic 1995: CO 1.192 gr/km; NOx 0.476 gr/km
480 GT Turbo 1995: CO 0.96 gr/km; NOx 0.29 gr/km
All these cars are Euro 2 compliant. It is interesting to see that the manual gearbox 480 are Euro 4 compliant for its CO emissions, but can never meet NOx emissions.
Robert.

Present cars: 1994 Volvo 480 GT 2.0i, 1999 Volvo S70 2.5 Europa, 2010 Volvo V70 2.0F Momentum

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