Engine Electrics

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yorkievolvo
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Engine Electrics

Post by yorkievolvo » Thu Sep 05, 2019 12:04 pm

Been going around in circles checking topics on the forum, trying to put together a 'How To' detailing getting a non-starting car to start. No success!
Has anybody got info detailing the whereabouts of the various parts of the engine electrical systems?
Photographs / drawings ( / whatever) showing locations and names would be most helpful.
Also explanations of what the various components / bits do.
My car is a 1991 turbo auto with a B18FT-107 motor.
All info welcome.

jifflemon
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Re: Engine Electrics

Post by jifflemon » Thu Sep 05, 2019 10:19 pm

Got lots!

But define non-start a little more.

Will it crank?
Can you hear the fuel pump?
Checked for a spark?

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brinkie
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Re: Engine Electrics

Post by brinkie » Fri Sep 06, 2019 1:11 pm

And it's got an auto box, so there's the possibility of a faulty P/N switch too (you can only start with the gear lever in park or neutral position)
Robert.

Present cars: 1994 Volvo 480 GT 2.0i Vase Green, 2010 Volvo V70 2.0F Momentum Mystic Silver
Past: 1981 Talbot-Matra Murena 2.2 Rouge Mephisto, 1995 Volvo 480 GT 2.0i Paris Blue

yorkievolvo
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Re: Engine Electrics

Post by yorkievolvo » Sun Sep 08, 2019 9:02 pm

The questions asked, and info provided, by jifflemon and Brinkie (thank you gentlemen) led to this:
Connected a spare spark plug to the distributor, put gear selector to N and turned key to 'Start'. Engine spun over but no spark.
Same actions with P selected - same results.
Smelled petrol so assume fuel feeding correctly (?).
Made a cup of tea and checked Mr. Haynes notes. Persuaded that a visit to the local Volvo expert was in order.
Busy tomorrow so will arrange for Tuesday.
To be continued.

Alan 480
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Re: Engine Electrics

Post by Alan 480 » Mon Sep 09, 2019 11:49 am

yorkievolvo wrote:
Sun Sep 08, 2019 9:02 pm
The questions asked, and info provided, by jifflemon and Brinkie (thank you gentlemen) led to this:
Connected a spare spark plug to the distributor, put gear selector to N and turned key to 'Start'. Engine spun over but no spark.
Same actions with P selected - same results.
Smelled petrol so assume fuel feeding correctly (?).
Made a cup of tea and checked Mr. Haynes notes. Persuaded that a visit to the local Volvo expert was in order.
Busy tomorrow so will arrange for Tuesday.
To be continued.
but if the 'inhibitor' switch is faulty this could be the problem, not sure if it is on the box or on the gear lever?
find switch and 'jumper-it'
that would be my first port of call :wink:
Alan

480 ES 2litre x 2, C30 1.8ES, SS1

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jamescarruthers
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Location: Cambridge

Re: Engine Electrics

Post by jamescarruthers » Mon Sep 09, 2019 2:54 pm

Auto inhibitor stops the starter motor engaging
1987 Volvo 480 ES, 507274, 217 - Red (Ness)
2001 Volvo C70 2.4T convertible (Olivolvo)
2008 Mini Cooper convertible (Mau)

Previous 480's:
J123 CFU -- ES
J449 MNL -- ES auto
D864 CPV -- ES
L691 JFC -- Turbo
F70 MNR -- ES
H858 FGV -- Turbo auto
E981 KHM -- ES (509849)

jifflemon
480 Is my middle name
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Re: Engine Electrics

Post by jifflemon » Mon Sep 09, 2019 7:57 pm

lets start with some basics:

Image

now when you tested for a spark, did you test from the king lead, or a spark plug end? either way....
Image

yorkievolvo
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Re: Engine Electrics

Post by yorkievolvo » Tue Sep 10, 2019 4:14 pm

Sorry, jifflemon, I didn't make it clear. It's a B18FT engine with Bosch EZ210K ignition.
The car's in the garage, has been started but ran for only a few seconds.
These bits have been requested:
full set of ignition leads (inc from coil to distributor),
ignition coil,
distributor cap,
flywheel sensor.
Going to post on 'Wanted'.
Thanks everybody.

Alan 480
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Location: Aberdeen

Re: Engine Electrics

Post by Alan 480 » Wed Sep 11, 2019 11:42 am

jamescarruthers wrote:
Mon Sep 09, 2019 2:54 pm
Auto inhibitor stops the starter motor engaging
technically correct as the inhibit switch is in the feed to the solenoid :wink:

located on top of gear box for future reference :-0
Alan

480 ES 2litre x 2, C30 1.8ES, SS1

yorkievolvo
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Re: Engine Electrics

Post by yorkievolvo » Mon Sep 16, 2019 2:42 pm

Update.
Latest from garage reckons problem narrowed down to ' amplifier for the coil pack'.
I can't find that term in the Parts book, although there are a couple of 'control units' in the ignition circuit.
Does 'ampli...' mean anything to anybody?
Has anybody got a spare one for sale?

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jamescarruthers
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Re: Engine Electrics

Post by jamescarruthers » Mon Sep 16, 2019 3:00 pm

Hopefully someone who is more in to Turbos than me (well I'm in to them but I just don't have one anymore!). 

I think the coil (big canister thing) is quite expensive on those cars (like £100 compared to the N/A car's very cheap item shared with many other cars). The ignition module looks like it is available separately here:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/c/909634208‎
1987 Volvo 480 ES, 507274, 217 - Red (Ness)
2001 Volvo C70 2.4T convertible (Olivolvo)
2008 Mini Cooper convertible (Mau)

Previous 480's:
J123 CFU -- ES
J449 MNL -- ES auto
D864 CPV -- ES
L691 JFC -- Turbo
F70 MNR -- ES
H858 FGV -- Turbo auto
E981 KHM -- ES (509849)

Robou
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Posts: 255
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Re: Engine Electrics

Post by Robou » Mon Sep 16, 2019 9:29 pm

Some odd misinformation here.
The turbo has just a cheap standard coil for transistorized ignition. The coil connects to 12V at ignition on. A small module, holding two transistors, is connected to the other spade on the coil and connects/disconnects to ground. The latter action causes a spark.
This module, call it an amplifier, is managed by a small signal from a transistor in the EZ210K.
A strange way of error finding by exchanging every part of the ignition system as far as it is visible. Maybe that's why the rotor isn't on the list. But just exchanging parts till the culprit is found seems common practice nowadays.

The process can easily be checked with a multimeter. The only way to blow the module is to directly connect it to 12V.
Too old to bother
480 Turbo midst '91

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jamescarruthers
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Re: Engine Electrics

Post by jamescarruthers » Wed Sep 18, 2019 3:52 pm

Isn't this type in N/A car's much cheaper:
Image

than this type on Turbo cars?:
Image

That's all I'm saying really
1987 Volvo 480 ES, 507274, 217 - Red (Ness)
2001 Volvo C70 2.4T convertible (Olivolvo)
2008 Mini Cooper convertible (Mau)

Previous 480's:
J123 CFU -- ES
J449 MNL -- ES auto
D864 CPV -- ES
L691 JFC -- Turbo
F70 MNR -- ES
H858 FGV -- Turbo auto
E981 KHM -- ES (509849)

Robou
Knows an Aerodeck isn't a 480
Posts: 255
Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2007 11:34 pm

Re: Engine Electrics

Post by Robou » Wed Sep 18, 2019 8:57 pm

Is this a reaction on my post or did you just have the urge to say something?
Too old to bother
480 Turbo midst '91

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jamescarruthers
480 Is my middle name
Posts: 1614
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2003 3:19 pm
Location: Cambridge

Re: Engine Electrics

Post by jamescarruthers » Thu Sep 19, 2019 4:42 am

I have an urge to say something
1987 Volvo 480 ES, 507274, 217 - Red (Ness)
2001 Volvo C70 2.4T convertible (Olivolvo)
2008 Mini Cooper convertible (Mau)

Previous 480's:
J123 CFU -- ES
J449 MNL -- ES auto
D864 CPV -- ES
L691 JFC -- Turbo
F70 MNR -- ES
H858 FGV -- Turbo auto
E981 KHM -- ES (509849)

yorkievolvo
Started learning about 480
Posts: 51
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2014 4:34 pm

Re: Engine Electrics

Post by yorkievolvo » Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:20 pm

Update.
Ref. my post of the 16thSEP.
... problem narrowed down to ' amplifier for the coil pack'.
Has anybody got a spare one for sale?
Still looking for this 'amplifier'.
New: electrician added: 4-pin type required.

Alan 480
480 Connoisseur
Posts: 877
Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2011 9:03 am
Location: Aberdeen

Re: Engine Electrics

Post by Alan 480 » Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:54 pm

yorkievolvo wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:20 pm
Update.
Ref. my post of the 16thSEP.
... problem narrowed down to ' amplifier for the coil pack'.
Has anybody got a spare one for sale?
Still looking for this 'amplifier'.
New: electrician added: 4-pin type required.
given what Robou has stated, can you not search 'tinternet' for the Bosch part number?

My SS1 runs a 'standardish' coil and has an 'amplifier-module' clagged onto the dizzy ,
in effect FOUR wires, and chassis
12V,
TWO from pick-up inside dizzy,
to low tension side of coil
earth, via the body of the amplifier

and it comes in two flavours, LUCAS & Bosch, depending on which dizzy .. . .
altough the amplifier on mine is now mounted on inner wing for easy access as it got an intermittant fault (AKA a bad connection)

try this link , can't go far wrong for < £5 . . . . .

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VOLVO-440K-4 ... SwzWldi1od
Alan

480 ES 2litre x 2, C30 1.8ES, SS1

yorkievolvo
Started learning about 480
Posts: 51
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2014 4:34 pm

Re: Engine Electrics

Post by yorkievolvo » Tue Oct 08, 2019 1:31 pm

Thanks Alan 480.
Ordered the item and should receive it by Friday.
On the road Saturday - hopefully.

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