Advice on buying a 480?

Here you can talk about the joy owning a Volvo 480 brings. Non-technical discussions take place here, like what is the difference between an ES and a S version.

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carlp
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Advice on buying a 480?

Post by carlp » Wed Feb 03, 2016 12:51 pm

Hi,
I am going to look at a late 95, manual, Celebration 480 in what looks like excellent condition, 1 previous owner, very low mileage (under 34k!!) with full main dealer service history. I would be interested to know what forum members think would be a "sensible" price to pay? I have looked at other cars on the web and prices seem to vary from £250 upwards...

All advice appreciated..

Thanks
Carl

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Re: Advice on buying a 480?

Post by Alan 480 » Wed Feb 03, 2016 7:34 pm

£250 sounds a bargain, if rear arches are tidy what have you to lose if they are asking £500? :wink:

considering :-

four tyres are £200, tank of fuel is £50

at least two years DIY motoring for the cost of a couple of 'garage' services

note of course 'low milage' doesn't equal NO problems . . . . .

but with a service history worth a punt, you an always sell it on if you don't like it?
Alan

480 ES 2litre 'Celebration' ? , C30 1.8ES, SS1

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Re: Advice on buying a 480?

Post by carlp » Wed Feb 03, 2016 8:05 pm

Alan,

The car I am considering is £3k not £250!! :cryhard: Is a good 480 worth that much?

Carl

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brinkie
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Re: Advice on buying a 480?

Post by brinkie » Wed Feb 03, 2016 10:42 pm

Depends on how the car has been used, or rather said, stored the past 20 or so years.

If the car has been outside all year long and the seller lives near the sea: run, don't walk.
My Paris Blue 480 ES had only 154,500 km (96,000 miles) on the clock, confirmed by extensive service history. The first owner lived in Den Helder (northwesternmost part of the country with sea all around), the second owner in The Hague (next to the sea shore) and the third in Leiden (10 km from the sea). Never garaged, always exposed to the elements.
I was a rust bucket! The rear arches were crumbling away, the rear inner bumper was virtually gone, the corners of the boot had rusted through. Nothing which couldn't be repaired, but my Vase Green 480 GT, which started its "life" at a Volvo dealership in Tilburg and moved to eastern part of the country (far away from the sea), has twice the mileage (over 200,000) and half the rust.

But if the car has been properly maintained, the paintwork is like new, no rust to be seen even under the rear floor mats and the rear inner bumper is still made out of steel instead of rust (you can inspect that if you look under the car) then the 2500 quid is well spent (never pay the asking price ;) ). Check when the cambelt has been changed, because they only last 6 years and they really do snap (and subsequently damage the cilinder head) if you don't replace them in time. When the last replacement is unclear from the service history, talk at least 500 quid off the price and transport the car on a trailer to a Volvo or Renault workshop where they can change the cambelt before doing anything else.

Nevertheless, it is a Volvo 480, so electrical gremlins and other mayhem may appear at any given point... :twisted:
Robert.

Present cars: 1994 Volvo 480 GT 2.0i, 1999 Volvo S70 2.5 Europa, 2010 Volvo V70 2.0F Momentum

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Re: Advice on buying a 480?

Post by carlp » Wed Feb 03, 2016 10:54 pm

Thanks Robert, very useful and wise words.

I have been told the car has been garaged all it's life and serviced by the main local Volvo dealer on an annual (I think but will check) basis. According to it's last 5 MOT records on line, the car's always passed without 'advisories' and has done about 800-1000 miles a year. I will check up on rust, cam belts and tyres (not too old) when I see the car tomorrow, hopefully they have all been changed on a regular basis.

Carl

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glasgowjim
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Re: Advice on buying a 480?

Post by glasgowjim » Wed Feb 03, 2016 11:19 pm

£3000 its not worth it !

even if its a mint condition its still not worth £3000 !!!!! :nuts: :bla: :crazy:

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brinkie
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Re: Advice on buying a 480?

Post by brinkie » Thu Feb 04, 2016 10:43 am

glasgowjim wrote:£3000 its not worth it !

even if its a mint condition its still not worth £3000 !!!!! :nuts: :bla: :crazy:
That's a discussion also quite topical in The Netherlands, where the 480 is surviving in greater numbers. According to howmanyleft.co.uk there were exactly 480 480's left recently... in NL over 1100 with valid registration, of which about 700 realistically exist (the rest probably not yet cancelled the registration which legally ends the existence of the car).
I have paid €1500 for my car. :crazy: I should have paid no more than €750 in hindsight. So here is a quick breakdown of the cost so far from memory, the figures aren't precise but you'll get an idea.
Suppose I paid €1500 for this car in the color and engine configuration I liked. New cambelt, exhaust pipe, fresh seals so no water leakage, new rear hatch wiring loom recently done by previous owner.
Volvo 480 GT 2.0 MY 1995 (Dutch spec GT which is basically the Celebration in the UK) with 325,000 km on the clock, over 200,000 miles. Stupid me. But the electrical state of the car was, and still is, flawless. And it has both the armrest with cupholders, extra gauges and luggage blind. Plus a working aircon and a very good interior (somebody really took care of that, there are very few signs of wear)
Anyway, off to the repair bills...
Miscellaneous new and second-hand stuff to right several wrongs, including replacing cracked fog light: €200
First service: €600 (needed new front brake disks, new hydraulic engine mount)
New rear arches, rear inner bumper restoration and respray; MOT repairs; New suspension arms, new tie rod ends, new ball joints, new drop links: €1500
New rear light clusters and seals, as good-as-new center plate, new front light clusters: €570 (will be even more expensive today!). Sold the old ones for €220 so actual cost is €350.
Complete overhaul of rear suspension (all stabilizers, rubber bits, rear axle sandblasted and resprayed), new exhaust front pipe + lambda sond, new springs and NOS red Koni shocks all around: €1000
Not in the cost calculation: countless hours of spending on the Internet, searching for affordable parts.

Next MOT, the inspector said: Congratulations sir, your car is technically like new! Well thank you sir, that is almost 6000 Euro spent already in two years time, and there is 1000 Euro more work waiting (respray of the rest of the car). :nuts: Not to mention the engine overhaul because it turns out, after adjusting the valve clearances and a thourough inspection, that cilinder #2 only has 8 bar compression left.

Now who said that 3000 quid or 4000 Euro for a well-maintained, rust-free, low mileage mint condition 480 is not worth it? :bla:
Robert.

Present cars: 1994 Volvo 480 GT 2.0i, 1999 Volvo S70 2.5 Europa, 2010 Volvo V70 2.0F Momentum

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Re: Advice on buying a 480?

Post by glasgowjim » Thu Feb 04, 2016 11:42 pm

Me thats who ! :evil:

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Re: Advice on buying a 480?

Post by carlp » Fri Feb 05, 2016 1:15 am

Well, the vendor told me they were unwilling to move on price so I have decided to wait a bit longer and look at a few other (less expensive) 480s first to get a feel of what's available in the UK market. Hopefully a sensible decision rather than buying the first car I saw?? I also want a car to use on a regular basis and not to hide away in a garage (I have one of those already..).

Carl

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brinkie
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Re: Advice on buying a 480?

Post by brinkie » Mon Feb 08, 2016 10:26 am

Carl, I would try and find out who the friendly "local" 480 owners are, and let him or her tell all about the quirks and benefits of driving a 480 and see for yourself what a decent 480 looks like and drives. I still regret I didn't do that before buying mine, otherwise I might have gone for a Turbo instead of a 2 litre! In total I have seen three cars before deciding to buy this one. The first one was an MY 1995 Paris Blue 2.0 at a Volvo dealership and was so horribly bad both on out- and inside, that I didn't bother to go for a test drive and walked away. The second one was an MY 1993 red 480 S 2.0 with red dipstick, had an asking price of 3200 Euro (2500 pound on present exchange rate) and, despite the CHECK warning going off at startup and the oil warning light lighting up in a corner (apart from several other electrical problems and visible accident damage), the owner said the car was in perfect order. I thanked him politely for his time. The third one is the one I am presently driving in. Despite all things wrong on this very example and the high mileage, the owner was using the car on a regular basis and personally made the car weatherproof (documented with photographs). I have to knock on wood, but this car has let me down only once, I had a flat battery because I didn't close the hatch properly and the interior light was left on overnight. Jump started it with my wife's car and off I went.
Despite the 480-density being less and the average distance you have to cover being further than in The Netherlands, I wouldn't bother to travel to the other end of the country, especially if the seller is unwilling to move on price. Still, 3000 could be worth it, but it has to be proven with extensive maintenance history and the bodywork should be impeccable. Otherwise, walk away.
Robert.

Present cars: 1994 Volvo 480 GT 2.0i, 1999 Volvo S70 2.5 Europa, 2010 Volvo V70 2.0F Momentum

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jamescarruthers
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Re: Advice on buying a 480?

Post by jamescarruthers » Mon Feb 08, 2016 3:11 pm

Carl's been over to have a go in my 480! With every suspension component renewed apart from springs and strut tops (should have done the tops!) it feels factory fresh... in that respect anyway.
1987 Volvo 480 ES, 507274, 217 - Red (Ness)
2006 Citroen C6 Exclusive 3.0 petrol/LPG
2008 Mini Cooper convertible (Mau)

Previous 480's:
J123 CFU -- ES
J449 MNL -- ES auto
D864 CPV -- ES
L691 JFC -- Turbo
F70 MNR -- ES
H858 FGV -- Turbo auto
E981 KHM -- ES (509849)

carlp
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Re: Advice on buying a 480?

Post by carlp » Mon Feb 08, 2016 3:14 pm

jamescarruthers wrote:Carl's been over to have a go in my 480! With every suspension component renewed apart from springs and strut tops (should have done the tops!) it feels factory fresh... in that respect anyway.
.. and very nice it was as well. It sort of made me wonder if you need to spend £3k to get a nice useable car. I am not after a 'concours' model just something reliable I can use as a daily drive :D

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Re: Advice on buying a 480?

Post by glasgowjim » Mon Feb 08, 2016 5:53 pm

I repeat its not worth £3000 :D
As a daily driver it wont last long in concours condition.

All you need is a good solid relatively low mileage 480 .

Hell for £850 I would sell my car and put a full years mot on it as well MY 1992 1.7 ltr. 83K + a shed load ( literally ) of spares as well.

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brinkie
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Re: Advice on buying a 480?

Post by brinkie » Mon Feb 08, 2016 7:02 pm

glasgowjim wrote:As a daily driver it wont last long in concours condition.
True.
Robert.

Present cars: 1994 Volvo 480 GT 2.0i, 1999 Volvo S70 2.5 Europa, 2010 Volvo V70 2.0F Momentum

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Van
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Re: Advice on buying a 480?

Post by Van » Mon Feb 08, 2016 7:07 pm

Even with little mileage, a '95 car is a 21 year old car. Things go bad just because of age. The 3000 price is based on the illusion of a car that will look pristine (maybe it does) and has carefree driving (it will not).

In the Netherlands are several cars on offer from gold-diggers. Take a look at this car for 6,999. It's only an 'S' not ES as advertized. Red dipstick means oil consuming engine. No a/c. The APK (MOT) expired in October, 2011! Apparently they have been trying to sell this car for over 4 years, so it wasn't driven regularly.
after over 10 years parted with the 1995 Volvo 480 ES 2.0

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Re: Advice on buying a 480?

Post by carlp » Mon Feb 08, 2016 8:27 pm

brinkie wrote:In the Netherlands are several cars on offer from gold-diggers. Take a look at this car for 6,999. It's only an 'S' not ES as advertized. Red dipstick means oil consuming engine. No a/c. The APK (MOT) expired in October, 2011! Apparently they have been trying to sell this car for over 4 years, so it wasn't driven regularly.
Lots of photos all looking the same but none of the rear wheels aches ..

Must be a bargain, it been reduced from 9,999 :D LOL

Carl

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brinkie
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Re: Advice on buying a 480?

Post by brinkie » Tue Feb 09, 2016 2:06 pm

The body condition of that 480 is near perfect (it has been featured in a youngtimer magazine). The car started out as a 400 Euro project car, somebody put an info centre in and some new light clusters, after which it changed hands a couple of times. The mileage is genuine, but the price is ridiculous. It has been left unsold for almost 5 years now and is constantly being mocked on the Dutch 480 forum. :D The same seller has another 480 for sale, for a whopping 5,999 Euro, but that one runs on LPG and has over 266,000 km (165,000 miles) on the clock. Also, this one will probably be left unsold forever.
There are more cars for sale that have been advertised for years and years: http://www.gaspedaal.nl/Volvo/480/?srt=pr-d (though the list contains cars that have been sold long ago, or even scrapped - some web sites never seem to clean up)

Of course a 21 year old 480 is not problem free, but hey, even my 8 year old low mileage Ford Focus let me down twice with very expensive repairs (an A/C pipe failed two years ago and the alternator plus battery failed a couple of months ago), whereas the 480 is much cheaper to maintain as long as you avoid the official Volvo dealerships. If you see the 480 as a cheap banger, which you will happily throw away once the body rot has gone too far and/or it fails the MOT and repairs become too expensive, by any means, buy the cheapest you can find. If you are looking for a car which you'd like to preserve for future generations, look for a higher price bracket. :wink:

About low mileages: clocking is VERY easy on a 480 as the odometer is mechanical, also the cog wheel fails often so it's not uncommon that the odometer has missed several tens of thousands of miles, sometimes the clock has been replaced by Volvo dealer when this or another electrical gremlin with the speedometer happened. So when the seller can't prove the mileage history, I would slash a huge amount off the price, or just walk away.
Robert.

Present cars: 1994 Volvo 480 GT 2.0i, 1999 Volvo S70 2.5 Europa, 2010 Volvo V70 2.0F Momentum

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