Help needed. No start. No spark

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Edmundpwb2
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Help needed. No start. No spark

Post by Edmundpwb2 » Sun Sep 13, 2020 6:59 pm

Can anyone help. I have just picked up a 480 gt this weekend. It was driving around fine. However I parked up and it will now not start. There is no spark. I have changed the dizzy and the coil. The breakdown chappie said he thought it would either be the cam sensor or distributor. Can anyone shed any light on what the problem could be?

jifflemon
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Re: No start. No spark

Post by jifflemon » Sun Sep 13, 2020 7:51 pm

OK, my money is on the relay....

So, there's the main relay box in the drivers side scuttle.

Underneath it (and lord only knows why!) lie the fuel pump relay and ignition relay.

Stick your head where the pedals are and look up, and you'll see them both.

They're interchangeable - However, having sparks with no fuel is equally no fun!

Put your hand over them and feel if they "click" when the ignition is turned on.

However..... Changed the dizzy?? and coil? Have got the right ones? Honestly I'd put the originals back for now, try the relays first.

Failing that, next most likely culprit would be crank sensor. There's a how to here for the turbo, but they're all the same.

You could also quiz the built in diags to see if there's a code logged.

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dragonflyjewels
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Re: Help needed. No start. No spark

Post by dragonflyjewels » Sun Sep 13, 2020 8:17 pm

Hello edmundpwb, and welcome to the club ! Nice to know you have bought a GT, they are getting very rare these days. You will get all the help you need on here and I see jifflemon is on the case already.
Thanks to the pandemic we have not been able to have any meetings this year, but as soon as it's possible I shall be organising another day out and hope you can join us. Whereabouts are you ?
Sylvia

Snazzy - 1993 Paris Blue ES red dipstick 2.0i bought 2001
Lethal Lily - 1991 White Turbo
hubby has
Sven - 1994 Dark Green GT
Evil Eva 1992 Paris Blue Turbo

Edmundpwb2
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Re: Help needed. No start. No spark

Post by Edmundpwb2 » Sun Sep 13, 2020 8:43 pm

Thanks Jifflemon. I will try those checks on the relays tomorrow.

Edmundpwb2
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Re: Help needed. No start. No spark

Post by Edmundpwb2 » Sun Sep 13, 2020 8:46 pm

dragonflyjewels wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 8:17 pm
Hello edmundpwb, and welcome to the club ! Nice to know you have bought a GT, they are getting very rare these days. You will get all the help you need on here and I see jifflemon is on the case already.
Thanks to the pandemic we have not been able to have any meetings this year, but as soon as it's possible I shall be organising another day out and hope you can join us. Whereabouts are you ?
I'm in Taunton, Somerset. If I can make it to a meet In the future i will. I'm glad there is some help as this car seems to have a few issues! Love driving it when it goes though. I had a turbo 16 years ago and I have wanted to get another 480 ever since.

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dragonflyjewels
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Re: Help needed. No start. No spark

Post by dragonflyjewels » Sun Sep 13, 2020 8:54 pm

Lots of members on here sold a 480 and regretted it enough to buy another one! Personally I bought my first one in 2001 and still have it.
Nice to have you on board - I'm sure you will have your problems sorted very soon.
Sylvia

Snazzy - 1993 Paris Blue ES red dipstick 2.0i bought 2001
Lethal Lily - 1991 White Turbo
hubby has
Sven - 1994 Dark Green GT
Evil Eva 1992 Paris Blue Turbo

Edmundpwb2
480 Newbie
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Sep 09, 2020 11:17 pm

Re: No start. No spark

Post by Edmundpwb2 » Mon Sep 14, 2020 4:16 pm

jifflemon wrote:
Sun Sep 13, 2020 7:51 pm
OK, my money is on the relay....

So, there's the main relay box in the drivers side scuttle.

Underneath it (and lord only knows why!) lie the fuel pump relay and ignition relay.

Stick your head where the pedals are and look up, and you'll see them both.

They're interchangeable - However, having sparks with no fuel is equally no fun!

Put your hand over them and feel if they "click" when the ignition is turned on.

However..... Changed the dizzy?? and coil? Have got the right ones? Honestly I'd put the originals back for now, try the relays first.

Failing that, next most likely culprit would be crank sensor. There's a how to here for the turbo, but they're all the same.

You could also quiz the built in diags to see if there's a code logged.
Hello there.
I have cleaned the crank sensor and this didn't seem to help. I have tried to check the relay but I think they are all working. However I changed them over but this didn't seem to change anything. Still lack of spark.

How do I quiz the diags to see if there is a code? And is there anything else I can try? Many thanks

Edmundpwb2
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Re: Help needed. No start. No spark

Post by Edmundpwb2 » Mon Sep 14, 2020 6:42 pm

I have taken the battery out to charge and noticed the earth looks a bit ropey. Could this cause no spark? The earth from the engine to the side has gone brittle and green. And looks quite rusty where they are bolted and join together.

jifflemon
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Re: Help needed. No start. No spark

Post by jifflemon » Mon Sep 14, 2020 7:03 pm

Dodgy earth cables are standard. Wouldn't stop a spark, but certainly no harm in cleaning it up. You'd suffer from slow cranking (or no cranking) if it was in poor shape.

Have you reverted back to the original distributor and coil pack?

jifflemon
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Re: No start. No spark

Post by jifflemon » Mon Sep 14, 2020 7:05 pm

Edmundpwb2 wrote:
Mon Sep 14, 2020 4:16 pm
How do I quiz the diags to see if there is a code? And is there anything else I can try? Many thanks
From another thread (no point in me re-typing!)
dcwalker wrote:
Mon Aug 24, 2020 9:56 am
Right - first stop now is definitely to check the codes.

On the N/S strut pillar under the bonnet you'll see a small black box. That's the diagnostic code reader - it works with a little flashing light which translate to error codes.

There is plenty on here and the main site about the system and how to operate it, but for starters:
  • Open box, plug the little connector that is stored in the lid into socket "2".
    Turn on ignition (don't start car) and after about 10 seconds press and hold the button next to the little red light for about 2 seconds (between 1 and 3 is the formal instruction!).
    The red light should start to flash.
    If it flashes once, pause, once, pause, once that means there are no codes stored.
    If it flashes any other combination (eg twice, pause, once, pause, once) that is an error code.
    Press the button again for 2 seconds and see if it flashes the same or different - there may be more than one error.
It sounds (and is) a rather clunky system but it was the height of sophistication in its day and actually, if it remains fully functioning, you can do an awful lot with it.

You can check the error codes for yourself on the site, or else just post back here what they are and I'll translate them for you.

Good luck!

David

Edmundpwb2
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Re: Help needed. No start. No spark

Post by Edmundpwb2 » Mon Sep 14, 2020 7:07 pm

I have put the coil and dizzy cap back as was.

jifflemon
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Re: Help needed. No start. No spark

Post by jifflemon » Mon Sep 14, 2020 8:44 pm

when you say "no spark", is that no spark AT the plug? Are you getting a spark from the coil lead?

Edmundpwb2
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Re: Help needed. No start. No spark

Post by Edmundpwb2 » Mon Sep 14, 2020 10:15 pm

Neither. The breakdown chap checked the lead from the coil and said there was no spark.

jifflemon
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Re: Help needed. No start. No spark

Post by jifflemon » Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:39 am

Unplug the coil connector.
The the tab facing upwards, there's 3 pins. (A,B,C). Stick a voltmeter between A and B. Switch ignition on. Do you get battery voltage?
Then check resistance between B and earth; should be 0 ohms

dcwalker
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Re: Help needed. No start. No spark

Post by dcwalker » Tue Sep 15, 2020 9:47 pm

Sorry for being slow to join in here - been away for a few days and, anyway, Jeff has been saying everything I might say (and even quoting me ;) ).

Knowing the 480 this could be any number of things, so I would definitely say tackle the code-reader before you carry on; it might help avoid a lot of changing this and changing that in the hope of hitting the right thing.

If doing the checks Jeff mentioned regarding the coil pack gives the wrong results, that is certainly a likely candidate. But if any one of the sensors in the ignition system have packed up whereby the system just doesn't kick into life, lack of spark might just be the only obvious symptom, rather than indicating a problem with the items immediately associated with creating that spark.

May even be the ECU itself...

Between us we will in all likelihood have spares that you can at least borrow to try out, but if you can narrow things down first that would obviously be best. As I said in the thread Jeff quoted, read the codes and come back to us - I and other will happily interpret then for you.

On a more general note, what colour is your GT? Fingers crossed it's the best of the 2 colours (green) but as you will see I am perhaps a little biased... ;)

David
Current: 1994 480 GT (plus 2004 C70 Collection & 1995 440 ES)
Previous: Celebration 467 (returned to Martin Mc); Celebration 346 (re-homed with Alan480); Celebration 269 (scrapped abandoned project), Celebration 73 (sold on after 6 years), 1992 ES, 1988 ES - and numerous other non-480 Volvos!

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dragonflyjewels
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Re: Help needed. No start. No spark

Post by dragonflyjewels » Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:40 am

I was hoping it's the red one recently auctioned in the south west! It would be nice to have a bit of variety in the GT line up.......
Sylvia

Snazzy - 1993 Paris Blue ES red dipstick 2.0i bought 2001
Lethal Lily - 1991 White Turbo
hubby has
Sven - 1994 Dark Green GT
Evil Eva 1992 Paris Blue Turbo

Edmundpwb2
480 Newbie
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Sep 09, 2020 11:17 pm

Re: Help needed. No start. No spark

Post by Edmundpwb2 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 6:59 pm

Well I have had a few minutes to tinker this evening. But first I should let you know my GT is the Green one. I have been told there are not too many left of the green version. But both look good to me. I got it from ebay recently. Would send a picture but can't seem to attach one on here. Can someone explain how?

Right then back to the problem in hand. I have tried the diagnostics box. And I got the all clear sequence as far as I could work out. Although I have had the battery out to charge so I don't know if this wipes it?

I have got my multi meter out on the tab from the coil and I did not get any volt reading from a to b with the ignition on. And the ohms was 0.06 when I set my ohms at 20k. I guess it should have power to the coil.

I have found some other dodgy looking wiring around the front which I may need someone to identify for me. I can see bare wire parts of wires although I don't this has anything to do with the coil.

Oh and thanks all for all the help and kind messages so far. I have a feeling I will be requesting help a fair amount.

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MisterH
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Re: Help needed. No start. No spark

Post by MisterH » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:02 pm

Edmundpwb2 wrote:
Wed Sep 16, 2020 6:59 pm
Well I have had a few minutes to tinker this evening. But first I should let you know my GT is the Green one. I have been told there are not too many left of the green version. But both look good to me. I got it from ebay recently. Would send a picture but can't seem to attach one on here. Can someone explain how?

Right then back to the problem in hand. I have tried the diagnostics box. And I got the all clear sequence as far as I could work out. Although I have had the battery out to charge so I don't know if this wipes it?

I have got my multi meter out on the tab from the coil and I did not get any volt reading from a to b with the ignition on. And the ohms was 0.06 when I set my ohms at 20k. I guess it should have power to the coil.

I have found some other dodgy looking wiring around the front which I may need someone to identify for me. I can see bare wire parts of wires although I don't this has anything to do with the coil.
When you click the picture button, you will have two [img] tags: Image

Go to a photo hosting website, I use Postimage.org, and upload a photo to there, you will then get an option for a "direct link", copy this and Ctrl+V it into the space between the two tags.


I love the green colour of the GTs, glad this one has been saved!

Hope this helps
Current Jobs to do (12/9/20):
Fix Central Locking
Bodywork
Suspension creaking below 40mph

jifflemon
480 Is my middle name
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Re: Help needed. No start. No spark

Post by jifflemon » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:42 pm

OK, quick one from me - Has it EVER been running whilst in your possession?

Edmundpwb2
480 Newbie
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Re: Help needed. No start. No spark

Post by Edmundpwb2 » Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:47 pm

Yes it ran when I got it. Last Saturday. Drove it back from where I bought it which was about 40 miles then drove it about a fair amount on the Sunday. Took my daughter to the park in it after a trip to a local wicks then it would not start from that point onwards.

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