More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
Moderators: jifflemon, coyote1980, Rachel
More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
Hello fellow enthusiasts,
Well I thought I was getting close to the point where I might actually get the car back on the road.... but no, of course there was always going to be trouble lurking under the bonnet, just when I didn't want it..
So far, I have replaced the:
1) Distributor and rotor arm
2) HT Leads
3) Plugs
4) Temperature sensor
5) Air filter
6) Air flow meter
7) Idle control valve.
Thermostat
9) Oil and oil filter
10) Coil pack
Yesterday, having moved the car onto the drive (which slopes down at about 20 degrees or so), I ran the engine to normal working temperature, noting that the existing problem I'd been trying to cure by replacing the parts above was still present (basically the car wont rev steadily, but with the throttle held at a steady opening, revs drop off by about 500rpm then go back to where they were, on a regular cycle).
After about 10 minutes of idling, the engine stalled and whilst it does now start again, any attempt to move the car back up the drive, even with a big handful of revs, has the engine stalling. It is as if there is no power there at all. The idle is very lumpy now too, and there is an odd noise like a fluttering as the engine turns over.
The lambda sensor light (green triangle thing) has been displaying for a good while noe whilst repairs have been underway - I guess this means the Cat is goosed?
I was hoping to take the for its MOT in a week or so, but am feeling like it is a bit of a lost cause. I'd hate to have to scrap it - it has all the hallmarks of a low mileage / low use example (i.e. super interior and decent bodywork) but if the engine is shot to pieces, I don't really know what to do next.
Any ideas, or advice, anyone?
Well I thought I was getting close to the point where I might actually get the car back on the road.... but no, of course there was always going to be trouble lurking under the bonnet, just when I didn't want it..
So far, I have replaced the:
1) Distributor and rotor arm
2) HT Leads
3) Plugs
4) Temperature sensor
5) Air filter
6) Air flow meter
7) Idle control valve.
Thermostat
9) Oil and oil filter
10) Coil pack
Yesterday, having moved the car onto the drive (which slopes down at about 20 degrees or so), I ran the engine to normal working temperature, noting that the existing problem I'd been trying to cure by replacing the parts above was still present (basically the car wont rev steadily, but with the throttle held at a steady opening, revs drop off by about 500rpm then go back to where they were, on a regular cycle).
After about 10 minutes of idling, the engine stalled and whilst it does now start again, any attempt to move the car back up the drive, even with a big handful of revs, has the engine stalling. It is as if there is no power there at all. The idle is very lumpy now too, and there is an odd noise like a fluttering as the engine turns over.
The lambda sensor light (green triangle thing) has been displaying for a good while noe whilst repairs have been underway - I guess this means the Cat is goosed?
I was hoping to take the for its MOT in a week or so, but am feeling like it is a bit of a lost cause. I'd hate to have to scrap it - it has all the hallmarks of a low mileage / low use example (i.e. super interior and decent bodywork) but if the engine is shot to pieces, I don't really know what to do next.
Any ideas, or advice, anyone?
1991 ES White / 1995 ES Red / 1995 ES Red / 1994 S Black / 1995 Celebration Red / 1994 S Paris Blue / 1995 Celebration (again!) Red - Currently free of all extramarital cars, wrench-loose and fancy free
- doingitsideways
- 480 Expert
- Posts: 659
- Joined: Wed May 02, 2012 8:55 pm
- Location: Manchester
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
Sounds like some sort of vacuum leak to me, that's getting worse as the engine warms up.
Get it started and spray carb cleaner around all the hoses, joints, idle valve and inlet manifold one by one.
If engine note/speed changes at all, you've got a leak as it's sucking it in.
This would tie in with the Lambda light being on, as unmetered air causes the mixture to go out of whack.
The fluctuating idle could be the ecu trying to correct the mixture.
P.s.
Love how No. 8 automatically changed to
Get it started and spray carb cleaner around all the hoses, joints, idle valve and inlet manifold one by one.
If engine note/speed changes at all, you've got a leak as it's sucking it in.
This would tie in with the Lambda light being on, as unmetered air causes the mixture to go out of whack.
The fluctuating idle could be the ecu trying to correct the mixture.
P.s.
Love how No. 8 automatically changed to
"If you can't fix it with a hammer, it's an electrical fault!"
Hammers can't fix a 480!!!
Hammers can't fix a 480!!!
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
Thanks DIS,
My usual shop for car supplies was shut today, so no carb cleaner so far.
I'm guessing this stuff is flamable right>? Do I need to be ultra-careful spraying it around whilst the engine is running? I don't want my pride & joy going up in flames just when I'm so close to getting her back on the road!
I'll update when I've done the test
Cheers!
Martin
My usual shop for car supplies was shut today, so no carb cleaner so far.
I'm guessing this stuff is flamable right>? Do I need to be ultra-careful spraying it around whilst the engine is running? I don't want my pride & joy going up in flames just when I'm so close to getting her back on the road!
I'll update when I've done the test
Cheers!
Martin
1991 ES White / 1995 ES Red / 1995 ES Red / 1994 S Black / 1995 Celebration Red / 1994 S Paris Blue / 1995 Celebration (again!) Red - Currently free of all extramarital cars, wrench-loose and fancy free
- jamescarruthers
- 480 Is my middle name
- Posts: 2505
- Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2003 3:19 pm
- Location: Cambridge
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
I'm about to do some vacuum leak investigation myself.
Is it true that carb cleaner is better than Easy Start for this sort of investigation? I'm sure I read somewhere that it was but I can't remember why. Maybe the carb cleaner doesn't evaporate as quick, is that it?
Is it true that carb cleaner is better than Easy Start for this sort of investigation? I'm sure I read somewhere that it was but I can't remember why. Maybe the carb cleaner doesn't evaporate as quick, is that it?
1987 Volvo 480 ES, 507274, 217 - Red (Ness)
2006 Citroen C6 Exclusive 3.0 petrol/LPG
2008 Mini Cooper convertible (Mau)
Previous 480's:
J123 CFU -- ES
J449 MNL -- ES auto
D864 CPV -- ES
L691 JFC -- Turbo
F70 MNR -- ES
H858 FGV -- Turbo auto
E981 KHM -- ES (509849)
2006 Citroen C6 Exclusive 3.0 petrol/LPG
2008 Mini Cooper convertible (Mau)
Previous 480's:
J123 CFU -- ES
J449 MNL -- ES auto
D864 CPV -- ES
L691 JFC -- Turbo
F70 MNR -- ES
H858 FGV -- Turbo auto
E981 KHM -- ES (509849)
- doingitsideways
- 480 Expert
- Posts: 659
- Joined: Wed May 02, 2012 8:55 pm
- Location: Manchester
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
Easy start works too.
I've just always used it and it works, so stuck with it.
Plus, there's always a tin around.
There's no easy start in my shed as I can't stand the stuff. My mate's Vectra will only start with it now.
I wouldn't worry about it going up in flames.
Yes, it's flamable, but you'd have to use a fair bit on something glowing red hot for it to go up.
I've just always used it and it works, so stuck with it.
Plus, there's always a tin around.
There's no easy start in my shed as I can't stand the stuff. My mate's Vectra will only start with it now.
I wouldn't worry about it going up in flames.
Yes, it's flamable, but you'd have to use a fair bit on something glowing red hot for it to go up.
"If you can't fix it with a hammer, it's an electrical fault!"
Hammers can't fix a 480!!!
Hammers can't fix a 480!!!
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
Well, I got myself a can of Carb Cleaner (£4.50 at the local car emporium who I go to as I cant stand Half Ords..)..
Got the car started, albeit with a decidedly lumpy tickover.
Sprayed the various visible hoses one by one...
Nothing..
Might be that the problem is somewhat obscured by the lumpy tickover??
Will have another go in an hour or so - I watched a few Youtube videos on the subject beforehand, to give me a clear idea of what to look out for.
Watch this space
Got the car started, albeit with a decidedly lumpy tickover.
Sprayed the various visible hoses one by one...
Nothing..
Might be that the problem is somewhat obscured by the lumpy tickover??
Will have another go in an hour or so - I watched a few Youtube videos on the subject beforehand, to give me a clear idea of what to look out for.
Watch this space
1991 ES White / 1995 ES Red / 1995 ES Red / 1994 S Black / 1995 Celebration Red / 1994 S Paris Blue / 1995 Celebration (again!) Red - Currently free of all extramarital cars, wrench-loose and fancy free
-
- Can tell where the 480 was built
- Posts: 337
- Joined: Tue Feb 28, 2012 3:25 pm
- Location: Northants
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
Hi,
have you considered that there could be a bad injector seal? This equates effectively to a vacuum leak but would be hard to detect. I guess you could get some carb cleaner in that area. Worth a shot. Also, you mention a fluttering noise when cranking........ to me, fluttering would mean the sort of noise a diaphragm might make. Unlikely, but could there be a problem with your fuel pressure regulator?
Just throwing an extra couple of ideas in there........ Good luck with it, hope you get it sorted and if I have any more thoughts I'll throw them into the mix! Don't give up, everything is fixable!
have you considered that there could be a bad injector seal? This equates effectively to a vacuum leak but would be hard to detect. I guess you could get some carb cleaner in that area. Worth a shot. Also, you mention a fluttering noise when cranking........ to me, fluttering would mean the sort of noise a diaphragm might make. Unlikely, but could there be a problem with your fuel pressure regulator?
Just throwing an extra couple of ideas in there........ Good luck with it, hope you get it sorted and if I have any more thoughts I'll throw them into the mix! Don't give up, everything is fixable!
O.C. 480 D.
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
Your problems, as for idling and revs and no power when revving up are typical for a MAF not connected or completely out of order. You're sure you replaced it with the right type and/or it is connected?
Too old to bother
480 Turbo midst '91
480 Turbo midst '91
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
I had a fairly similar problem, with erratic idle, and found carb cleaner and wynns injector cleaner have worked wonders
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
Took thar to the garage today and according to them, the air flow meter thing (next to the fuse box) should be connected to the intake manifold.
You can see from this pic that something appears to have been disconnected at some point.
When I got to the garage this afternoon, they'd found one of the pipes that connects to the mainfold (the one at the rear of the engine, closer to the bulkhead). Question is, should there be another pipe connected at the front and if so, what does it connect to?
I think this has to be the root cause of the rough running, as the OBD code on position 2 (fuel system) indicates a problem with the air flow. (code 1-2-1)
Anyone offer any insights?
Martin
You can see from this pic that something appears to have been disconnected at some point.
When I got to the garage this afternoon, they'd found one of the pipes that connects to the mainfold (the one at the rear of the engine, closer to the bulkhead). Question is, should there be another pipe connected at the front and if so, what does it connect to?
I think this has to be the root cause of the rough running, as the OBD code on position 2 (fuel system) indicates a problem with the air flow. (code 1-2-1)
Anyone offer any insights?
Martin
1991 ES White / 1995 ES Red / 1995 ES Red / 1994 S Black / 1995 Celebration Red / 1994 S Paris Blue / 1995 Celebration (again!) Red - Currently free of all extramarital cars, wrench-loose and fancy free
- doingitsideways
- 480 Expert
- Posts: 659
- Joined: Wed May 02, 2012 8:55 pm
- Location: Manchester
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
Could have just had a blanking plug on it,as that's where the boost guage plumbs in on the Turbos.
Open, like that, will definitely cause running problems as there ia a lot of unmetered air being sucked in, causing lean running.
If you'd sprayed carb cleaner there with the engine running, it would have been obvious.
Open, like that, will definitely cause running problems as there ia a lot of unmetered air being sucked in, causing lean running.
If you'd sprayed carb cleaner there with the engine running, it would have been obvious.
"If you can't fix it with a hammer, it's an electrical fault!"
Hammers can't fix a 480!!!
Hammers can't fix a 480!!!
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
Ha ha - I was more concerned about setting the thing on fire by spraying flammable liquid at it, than thinking about the possibility of things not being in their correct place..
But thanks James for the swift and insightful response. When I left the car this evening at the garage, the friendly mechanic had got it running far more smoothly than I'd ever managed, and was still tinkering with the air flow thing. So, you never know, this might well move the car one step closer to being back on the road.
Next major problem is likely to be the MOT - the speedo doesn't work and neither does the fuel gauge, not to mention a nasty hole in the sill that will need welding.
I am beginning to feel there may be a chance of re-commissioning soon though - maybe an early birthday present for myself Hurrah!!
But thanks James for the swift and insightful response. When I left the car this evening at the garage, the friendly mechanic had got it running far more smoothly than I'd ever managed, and was still tinkering with the air flow thing. So, you never know, this might well move the car one step closer to being back on the road.
Next major problem is likely to be the MOT - the speedo doesn't work and neither does the fuel gauge, not to mention a nasty hole in the sill that will need welding.
I am beginning to feel there may be a chance of re-commissioning soon though - maybe an early birthday present for myself Hurrah!!
1991 ES White / 1995 ES Red / 1995 ES Red / 1994 S Black / 1995 Celebration Red / 1994 S Paris Blue / 1995 Celebration (again!) Red - Currently free of all extramarital cars, wrench-loose and fancy free
- jamescarruthers
- 480 Is my middle name
- Posts: 2505
- Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2003 3:19 pm
- Location: Cambridge
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
You're welcome. Good luck!
1987 Volvo 480 ES, 507274, 217 - Red (Ness)
2006 Citroen C6 Exclusive 3.0 petrol/LPG
2008 Mini Cooper convertible (Mau)
Previous 480's:
J123 CFU -- ES
J449 MNL -- ES auto
D864 CPV -- ES
L691 JFC -- Turbo
F70 MNR -- ES
H858 FGV -- Turbo auto
E981 KHM -- ES (509849)
2006 Citroen C6 Exclusive 3.0 petrol/LPG
2008 Mini Cooper convertible (Mau)
Previous 480's:
J123 CFU -- ES
J449 MNL -- ES auto
D864 CPV -- ES
L691 JFC -- Turbo
F70 MNR -- ES
H858 FGV -- Turbo auto
E981 KHM -- ES (509849)
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
Hmm, I guess I'll find out when I get the bill from the garage tomorrow! Thanks for your thoughts - much appreciateddoingitsideways wrote:Could have just had a blanking plug on it,as that's where the boost guage plumbs in on the Turbos.
Open, like that, will definitely cause running problems as there ia a lot of unmetered air being sucked in, causing lean running.:
1991 ES White / 1995 ES Red / 1995 ES Red / 1994 S Black / 1995 Celebration Red / 1994 S Paris Blue / 1995 Celebration (again!) Red - Currently free of all extramarital cars, wrench-loose and fancy free
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
I was wondering if anyone had any photos of a standard 1.7 engine bay set up, for comparison purposes? Most of the pics on Google appear to be turbo models...
Please point me at relevant pics on the forum, or post new images if possible.
The photo above is one I took when I first acquired the car - it looks a lot cleaner now, with a good few parts polished up and replaced
Cheers!
Martin
Please point me at relevant pics on the forum, or post new images if possible.
The photo above is one I took when I first acquired the car - it looks a lot cleaner now, with a good few parts polished up and replaced
Cheers!
Martin
1991 ES White / 1995 ES Red / 1995 ES Red / 1994 S Black / 1995 Celebration Red / 1994 S Paris Blue / 1995 Celebration (again!) Red - Currently free of all extramarital cars, wrench-loose and fancy free
- jamescarruthers
- 480 Is my middle name
- Posts: 2505
- Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2003 3:19 pm
- Location: Cambridge
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
Which engine do you have? It would be helpful so you don't get confused with different set ups. For example, my B18E wouldn't be much good to you.
Put your VIN into the VIN decoder on the main site http://www.volvo-480-europe.org/volvo480/vin_reader.php to find out
Put your VIN into the VIN decoder on the main site http://www.volvo-480-europe.org/volvo480/vin_reader.php to find out
1987 Volvo 480 ES, 507274, 217 - Red (Ness)
2006 Citroen C6 Exclusive 3.0 petrol/LPG
2008 Mini Cooper convertible (Mau)
Previous 480's:
J123 CFU -- ES
J449 MNL -- ES auto
D864 CPV -- ES
L691 JFC -- Turbo
F70 MNR -- ES
H858 FGV -- Turbo auto
E981 KHM -- ES (509849)
2006 Citroen C6 Exclusive 3.0 petrol/LPG
2008 Mini Cooper convertible (Mau)
Previous 480's:
J123 CFU -- ES
J449 MNL -- ES auto
D864 CPV -- ES
L691 JFC -- Turbo
F70 MNR -- ES
H858 FGV -- Turbo auto
E981 KHM -- ES (509849)
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
Hello James,
Apparently it is a B18F-106
Does that help?
Martin
Apparently it is a B18F-106
Does that help?
Martin
1991 ES White / 1995 ES Red / 1995 ES Red / 1994 S Black / 1995 Celebration Red / 1994 S Paris Blue / 1995 Celebration (again!) Red - Currently free of all extramarital cars, wrench-loose and fancy free
- jamescarruthers
- 480 Is my middle name
- Posts: 2505
- Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2003 3:19 pm
- Location: Cambridge
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
Yes and good news, I have the Volvo green book for this set with instructions to fault find each pin.
I just need to work out how to scan a PDF it to you.
I just need to work out how to scan a PDF it to you.
1987 Volvo 480 ES, 507274, 217 - Red (Ness)
2006 Citroen C6 Exclusive 3.0 petrol/LPG
2008 Mini Cooper convertible (Mau)
Previous 480's:
J123 CFU -- ES
J449 MNL -- ES auto
D864 CPV -- ES
L691 JFC -- Turbo
F70 MNR -- ES
H858 FGV -- Turbo auto
E981 KHM -- ES (509849)
2006 Citroen C6 Exclusive 3.0 petrol/LPG
2008 Mini Cooper convertible (Mau)
Previous 480's:
J123 CFU -- ES
J449 MNL -- ES auto
D864 CPV -- ES
L691 JFC -- Turbo
F70 MNR -- ES
H858 FGV -- Turbo auto
E981 KHM -- ES (509849)
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
Hello James - I will pm my email address to you if that helps ?
Cheers!
Martin
Cheers!
Martin
1991 ES White / 1995 ES Red / 1995 ES Red / 1994 S Black / 1995 Celebration Red / 1994 S Paris Blue / 1995 Celebration (again!) Red - Currently free of all extramarital cars, wrench-loose and fancy free
- jamescarruthers
- 480 Is my middle name
- Posts: 2505
- Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2003 3:19 pm
- Location: Cambridge
Re: More Engine Problems - Any Ideas Please
Yes, do that. I'll photograph them with my phone. I would scan and convert to PDF at work but I'm off for two weeks.
1987 Volvo 480 ES, 507274, 217 - Red (Ness)
2006 Citroen C6 Exclusive 3.0 petrol/LPG
2008 Mini Cooper convertible (Mau)
Previous 480's:
J123 CFU -- ES
J449 MNL -- ES auto
D864 CPV -- ES
L691 JFC -- Turbo
F70 MNR -- ES
H858 FGV -- Turbo auto
E981 KHM -- ES (509849)
2006 Citroen C6 Exclusive 3.0 petrol/LPG
2008 Mini Cooper convertible (Mau)
Previous 480's:
J123 CFU -- ES
J449 MNL -- ES auto
D864 CPV -- ES
L691 JFC -- Turbo
F70 MNR -- ES
H858 FGV -- Turbo auto
E981 KHM -- ES (509849)